Resumption of Racing – Stakes Levels through to the end of the 2019-20 Season

[Chief Stipe]

6 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

So you are creating something out of nothing. 

 

Don't understand what you mean.

6 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Do you look favourably upon Winston Peters as a politician?

As a politician?  You have to admire and respect his mastery of the political art.  He is a Maori Muldoon.  He has been the consistently the most dominant NZ politician in the last 35 years.  His run has finally come to an end - father time has caught up with him.  Don't be surprised when he leaves Parliament that he doesn't remain amongst the living for very long.

Do I like his policies?  NO.  Do I like him as a person?  NO.  I've met him several times and found him to be an arrogant unsociable loner.

[Happy Sunrise]

1 minute ago, Chief Stipe said:

As a politician?  You have to admire and respect his mastery of the political art.  He is a Maori Muldoon.  He has been the consistently the most dominant NZ politician in the last 35 years.  His run has finally come to an end - father time has caught up with him.  Don't be surprised when he leaves Parliament that he doesn't remain amongst the living for very long.

Do I like his policies?  NO.  Do I like him as a person?  NO.  I've met him several times and found him to be an arrogant unsociable loner.

Admire his mastery of political art? You mean the art of being able to get away with doing sweet f**k all for a long time?

He basically has no profile for racing during coronavirus, and hadn't done much previously for an industry that is struggling. Yet, whether you like Jacinda Ardern and her  decisions or not, she has been decisive, calm and shown authority in her leadership during this crisis. 

At least she has the strength to plot a course in a difficult time and stick to it. This is unlike the MIA Peters, RITA and other racing bodies who never anywhere to be found.

How does someone appease the likes of you and Brodie? Put Simon Bridges in power?

[Chief Stipe]

12 hours ago, holy ravioli said:

its completely irrelevant..these are unchartered waters,despite the Chch quakes,after which a responsible Govt would have made a plan to cope with an event like this.

 

You do need to get out more Holy.  Put Das Kapital down and broaden your horizons. 

Ever heard of the NZ Pandemic Management Plan?  The one John Key used during the 2009-2010 Swine Flu pandemic?  You must know it - the one Adern threw out the window causing you to duck.

[Rangatira]

3 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

How does someone appease the likes of you and Brodie? Put Simon Bridges in power?

perish the thought, but if forced to choose in a 2 horse race, i would probably choose the brodster over simon 

[Basil]

23 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

Wrong Basil.  There are articles and video clips on line where Adern refers to Wigram and an 80,000 death toll and she used that as justification for the lockdown.  I guess Wigram and Motu - "have revised their modelling in the light of more accurate empircal data."

Cough cough - 

You might want to check your information. The earliest PM public reference to Wigram was on 5 April, when she said their modelling suggested the country might have had *4000 cases* of Covid-19 were the country not in lockdown. You can hear a discussion of it here:

https://www.iranz.org.nz/multimedia/audio.html

The *80,000 deaths* figure came from a totally different source:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120604818/new-model-shows-coronavirus-could-kill-80000-kiwis-without-lockdown

https://cpb-ap-se2.wpmucdn.com/blogs.auckland.ac.nz/dist/d/75/files/2017/01/Supression-and-Mitigation-New-Zealand-TPM-006.pdf

Bottom line: you're right about the scare-mongering, but wrong about the source.

 

[Happy Sunrise]

5 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

You do need to get out more Holy.  Put Das Kapital down and broaden your horizons. 

 

Stupid.

Still awaiting what you would have done differently. But then, to actually run a country faced with an unquantifiable threat to life takes a bit of courage and strength that is not found behind a keyboard armed with hindsight.

Enjoy your conversation. 

 

[Basil]

12 hours ago, holy ravioli said:

I see you are well indoctrinated with the 'free money' trope...off to bed...leave you with this...

'Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone. John Maynard Keynes.

Keynes never actually said that, it's a myth. His colleague EAG Robinson did say

"The great merit of the capitalist system, it has been said, is that it succeeds in using the nastiest motives of nasty people for the ultimate benefit of society."

Which obviously has a completely different meaning...

Robinson's wife, the socialist Joan Robinson, also observed after a trip to Africa:

"The only thing worse than being exploited by capitalists is not being exploited by capitalists."

[holy ravioli]

54 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

LOL.  Holy that's the oldest trick in the book normally played by lawyers when doing disclosure.  Essentially what you do is dump everything you can find remotely related to the case and disclose it to the other side EXCEPT you "overlook" some key one's which you "find" late in the process.  "Our apologies your honour but we overlooked these documents which we hope you understand given the sheer volume of documents that we have released."  The Judge wearily nods his head knowing full well that he has pulled the same trick many times before. 

In this case the Government will have to be legally challenged to get them released.  So it isn't what WAS released its what WASN'T released.

Reminds me of a story.  I was the plaintiff in a case and my lawyer and I were going through the disclosure process.  I had all sorts of documents in a big box.  In there was a Ski ticket.  I said "I suppose we don't need this."  I explained the tenuous connection to the case.  My lawyer smiled and said "throw it in, it will puzzle them and they will waste time trying to work out what relevance it is."

Same story here.

 

if you are really interested...David Parker who is probably smarter than the whole opposition front bench...

'

'I … want to highlight the dangerous route the Opposition is taking in targeting public servants. By summonsing to the Epidemic Response Committee the Solicitor General, the Police Commissioner and the Director-General of Health (when they would no doubt have agreed to a simple request to appear) in order to attempt to force the disclosure of privileged legal advice. By doing this the Committee is attacking not just fair process but the privileges of the Court. Legal privilege is not Parliament’s. Parliamentary has its own parliamentary privilege, and it is not for the Courts to remove that. Legal privilege is grounded in the common law. It is the Courts not Parliament that have care of legal privilege. We must both make efforts not to intrude on each other’s privileges. 

The current attack on that is an attack on comity – the constitutional separation of powers – between Parliament and the courts. That constitutional outrage is made worse in my view because it comes at a time when the Crown is facing legal action over the lockdown laws. I should put on record that the Chair of the committee The Honourable Simon Bridges was offered a confidential briefing on the advice and declin

[Nowornever]

11 hours ago, curious said:

she's quite cute.

With those teeth you could put a bridle on her and ride her in the first at Caulfield today.

[Noodlum]

9 minutes ago, Nowornever said:

With those teeth you could put a bridle on her and ride her in the first at Caulfield today.

But you need a bit to control the tongue.

 

[holy ravioli]

26 minutes ago, Basil said:

Keynes never actually said that, it's a myth. His colleague EAG Robinson did say

"The great merit of the capitalist system, it has been said, is that it succeeds in using the nastiest motives of nasty people for the ultimate benefit of society."

Which obviously has a completely different meaning...

Robinson's wife, the socialist Joan Robinson, also observed after a trip to Africa:

"The only thing worse than being exploited by capitalists is not being exploited by capitalists."

Its a myth that Robinson said that.

'The trouble with capitalism as a system is that only those who have or can get capital can make it work for them, and that leaves out damn near all of us. Molly Ivins
 

[Nowornever]

[holy ravioli]

3 minutes ago, Noodlum said:

But you need a bit to control the tongue.

 

The good thing about the deputy LOTO is that you can actually strap a saddle around her girth....now.♋

[the galah]

I think Winston has always been the voice of reason. I think his parties name, new zealand first,is an accurate reflection of how they view each decision they make. The rudder that helps guide the current government when the waters get choppy.

Under the National government we became a country driven solely by wealth,,they lost our social and environmental compass. 

The way each party has responded to the crisis just reflects their priorities. Personally i  am glad we have our current government with the New Zealand First influence. 

[holy ravioli]

I guess it had to descend to this....attacking the message =no traction...try attacking the messenger...the obsessional,apoplectic right who refuse to accept NZ has a P.M we can be proud of as borne out by world opinion.

It has been a long time.

[Chief Stipe]

24 minutes ago, holy ravioli said:

want to highlight the dangerous route the Opposition is taking in targeting public servants. By summonsing to the Epidemic Response Committee the Solicitor General, the Police Commissioner and the Director-General of Health (when they would no doubt have agreed to a simple request to appear) in order to attempt to force the disclosure of privileged legal advice. By doing this the Committee is attacking not just fair process but the privileges of the Court. Legal privilege is not Parliament’s. Parliamentary has its own parliamentary privilege, and it is not for the Courts to remove that. Legal privilege is grounded in the common law. It is the Courts not Parliament that have care of legal privilege. We must both make efforts not to intrude on each other’s privileges.

Parker would get an A+ for that effort in tautology and obfuscation.  Holy can you translate what it means to we mere minions?

26 minutes ago, holy ravioli said:

The current attack on that is an attack on comity – the constitutional separation of powers – between Parliament and the courts. That constitutional outrage is made worse in my view because it comes at a time when the Crown is facing legal action over the lockdown laws. I should put on record that the Chair of the committee The Honourable Simon Bridges was offered a confidential briefing on the advice and declin

Bridges point is that advice should have been available to ALL especially now.  But how could it when Adern closed Parliament!  Mind you that is probably acceptable to you as that is how the Communist Politburo operates.

Adern and Parker are doing a sloppy cover up.  The reason they are facing legal action is because they acted ILLEGALLY!  They had the time and unfortunately the power to make it legal!  They are so inept that they didn't do that!  THEY opened the Crown up to legal action.

I'm not particularly a fan of Bridges but Labour has gifted him a lifeline.  

[holy ravioli]

1 minute ago, Chief Stipe said:

Parker would get an A+ for that effort in tautology and obfuscation.  Holy can you translate what it means to we mere minions?

Bridges point is that advice should have been available to ALL especially now.  But how could it when Adern closed Parliament!  Mind you that is probably acceptable to you as that is how the Communist Politburo operates.

Adern and Parker are doing a sloppy cover up.  The reason they are facing legal action is because they acted ILLEGALLY!  They had the time and unfortunately the power to make it legal!  They are so inept that they didn't do that!  THEY opened the Crown up to legal action.

I'm not particularly a fan of Bridges but Labour has gifted him a lifeline.  

I applaud you can accept that you do not understand the dialogue.

On that basis just maybe you should stfu.

Parker again...

'

'The purpose of legal professional privilege is to enable legal advice to be sought and given in confidence. The basic principles arise from the public interest requiring full and frank exchange of confidence between solicitor and client to enable the client to receive necessary legal advice.  It is a necessary corollary to the right of any person to obtain skilled advice about the law. People must be able to consult their lawyers in absolute confidence, as otherwise they might hold back information, in fear it may afterwards be disclosed and used to their prejudice. This is why the House of Lords has described legal professional privilege as much more than an ordinary rule of evidence; it is a fundamental condition on which the administration of justice as a whole rests.'

…

[Brodie]

14 minutes ago, holy ravioli said:

Its a myth that Robinson said that.

'The trouble with capitalism as a system is that only those who have or can get capital can make it work for them, and that leaves out damn near all of us. Molly Ivins
 

So in other words, Holy Crap, you are jealous of people that have more than you?

So you agree with Ardern, that this is an opportunity to reduce the gap of inequality?

Well you will get it with your esteemed leader, leading the charge!

Problem is that you will know of plenty of people around you that will have their living standards lowered

[holy ravioli]

Just now, Brodie said:

So in other words, Holy Crap, you are jealous of people that have more than you?

So you agree with Ardern, that this is an opportunity to reduce the gap of inequality?

Well you will get it with your esteemed leader, leading the charge!

Problem is that you will know of plenty of people around you that will have their living standards lowered

You are  just so predictable...the jealousy/envy card....we should all believe in...trickledown theory,a rising tide lifts all boats,self regulation is vital for bankers,the free market always self corrects....a few of a number of very grim 'fairy tales'.

You have no idea of my financial status ,regardless.

[holy ravioli]

C19 is a rather convenient scapegoat for the inevitable collapse of financial chicanery foistered on society since the GFC...to maintain the status quo.

As for NZ's performance re the virus...its quite unanimous.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/08-05-2020/nz-is-winning-global-kudos-for-our-covid-19-response-how-do-we-use-it/

[Brodie]

9 minutes ago, holy ravioli said:

You are  just so predictable...the jealousy/envy card....we should all believe in...trickledown theory,a rising tide lifts all boats,self regulation is vital for bankers,the free market always self corrects....a few of a number of very grim 'fairy tales'.

You have no idea of my financial status ,regardless.

Geez you have got it bad!

Very very dangerous for NZ society, people with your ideas and theories!

Very cult like brainwashing!!

Holy, I can guess your financial position quite easily, you certainly don’t run a business and you are very reliant on the taxpayer handouts without doubt!

Anyway absolutely pointless debating with someone that continues to quote others as you are lost!!

Edited May 8, 2020 by Brodie

[holy ravioli]

2 minutes ago, Brodie said:

Geez you have got it bad!

Very very dangerous for NZ society, people with your ideas and theories!

Very cult like brainwashing!!

Holy, I can guess your financial position quite easily, you certainly don’t run a business and you are very reliant on the taxpayer handouts without doubt!

Anyway absolutely pointless debating with someone that continues to quote others as you are lost!!

Pathetic...you regurgitate tired phraseology and would never have had an original thought in ...your life.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Happy Sunrise said:

How does someone appease the likes of you and Brodie? Put Simon Bridges in power?

You see where you and I differ is I'm somewhat apolitical when it comes to doing what is right.  It isn't a Labour - National thing.  Sure philosophically I lean to the right of the political spectrum.  Possibly only because it is the right that consistently applies the economic theory that I think is best and consistently lets people get on with business and the freedoms associated with that.  I believe the compass of Governments should be limited to those things where the market fails.

My first memory of being politically aware dates back to 1972.  I ran for Parliament as a National candidate in 1984.  In 1987 I voted for Roger Douglas and his team to continue the reform that they were undertaking.

I respect our Parliamentary Democracy and the Westminster System it is based on.  I object vehemently when I see the principles enshrined in our system of Government overridden or abused.  That is one of my biggest objections to the way Adern has managed Covid-19.  She dissolved Parliament and instituted a system of Totalitarianism.  

[Rangatira]

does anyone know if the trials at addington on the 14th are being videoed ?

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, Happy Sunrise said:

Stupid.

Still awaiting what you would have done differently. But then, to actually run a country faced with an unquantifiable threat to life takes a bit of courage and strength that is not found behind a keyboard armed with hindsight.

Enjoy your conversation. 

 

Happy, this lockdown will have mainly losers.

Of course Ardern did right in closing the border, even though it was a bit slow.

Yes she was told there would be many many thousands dead if she didn’t act, and I doubt many would disagree with what she has done.

This was done to flatten the curve so that our hospitals could cope.

Once the curve was flattened then it was to eradicate or eliminate but apparently that doesn’t mean get rid of totally.

The hospitals have never ever been quieter and many have and will die due to the decision of our govt. not to do these operations etc.

It is going to take 18 months to catch up, there have been 60,000 medical appointments not happen and 30,000 ops not happen.

People have died without family and friends being able to see them before they passed away and Ardern lied about the no. That had been allowed to.

There are going to be many hundreds commit suicide due to this extended lockdown when it should’ve been eased off 2 weeks ago!

Yes Ardern is very good at facing up to the media and country when there is a tradgedy like, White  Island, the Mosque shooting and now the Covid19.

She is a trained speaker and was president I think of the socialist youth in NZ

The reality is that she has not successfully achieved any of the things that she campaigned on before the last election!!

Happy, what is your opinion on what she said in her email to her fellow pollies, that there was no need to defend anything, “because they have bought into it”?

What she is saying is that the suckers will do whatever I say!!!!!

Edited May 9, 2020 by Brodie