Happy Sunrise Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 Interesting article by Barry Lichter who puts all the pieces of an ugly puzzle together about the TAB https://www.lincolnfarms.co.nz/stories/what-happened-to-the-tabs-halcyon-days-an-a-to-z-of-what-brought-racing-to-its-knees/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 39 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said: Interesting article by Barry Lichter who puts all the pieces of an ugly puzzle together about the TAB https://www.lincolnfarms.co.nz/stories/what-happened-to-the-tabs-halcyon-days-an-a-to-z-of-what-brought-racing-to-its-knees/ What a very accurate article, very well written. Know from personal experienceI have been treated very poorly by the NZ TAB! Apart from massive restrictions and treated like a criminal, I have been lied to and not treated equally . Allen was useless, Saville is totally incompetent and most of the big wigs should be down The road for the decisions they have made. NZ Racing is stuffed as it has not been marketed to younger ones that should be coming thru but aren’t. There appears to be that many overpaid turkeys there it is not funny and it will be one of the downfalls of racing in the next year or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 A must read - spells out the facts and how poorly racing has been treated by the NZRB and over the recent 1-2 years by RITA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Sunrise Posted May 11, 2020 Author Share Posted May 11, 2020 41 minutes ago, LongOwner said: A must read - spells out the facts and how poorly racing has been treated by the NZRB and over the recent 1-2 years by RITA. It reads like the end of racing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 5 hours ago, Brodie said: . NZ Racing is stuffed as it has not been marketed to younger ones that should be coming thru but aren’t. Disagree with that.That is where i think the nz industry has always gone wrong in my opinion.. I have always believed if you want to increase your customer base then you should look at who your current customer base is. Your more likely to attract similar type customers to those you already have and not attract customers similar to those that you have very few of. Its just common sense to me and is what works in the real world. Who's more likely to have a punt on the horses or own a horse. The bloke with a girlfriend saving for a house,the bloke with the young family,or the couple (or single)over 40 years old who's family has left home and are financially stable? There are stereotypes of employment that are better targeted than others. Just as people that bet on sports are more likely to bet on horses than those that don't.. Sure,the big days which are social occasions may be attractive to the young once a year racegoers and sell themselves,as are the family days on the grass tracks where they can get close to the action. But why use marketing to target the once a year racegoers to an event that sells itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 Galah, yes you are correct that racing has to be promoted to people that want to currently punt! However racing thru the 70s was very popular as the stands at Addington were often full on a Saturday night. We have an almighty problem coming up if there are no new punters coming thru at all if they have not been attracted to racing. They don’t all of a sudden develop an interest in racing when they are in their 40’s and start punting on horses. This means no new owners as well, so without promotion to the young people then racing will be dead in the water. As someone said the average age of trackside viewers is people in their 60’s so the industry has a lot of work to do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Sunrise Posted May 11, 2020 Author Share Posted May 11, 2020 Maybe just market racing without the aim of trying to snare any age group. If the product is engaging then it doesn't matter the age group. Just use all means of technology and formats available (especially free ones) Harness racing needs to sort itself it as a product first and foremost. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Brodie said: Galah, yes you are correct that racing has to be promoted to people that want to currently punt! However racing thru the 70s was very popular as the stands at Addington were often full on a Saturday night. We have an almighty problem coming up if there are no new punters coming thru at all if they have not been attracted to racing. They don’t all of a sudden develop an interest in racing when they are in their 40’s and start punting on horses. This means no new owners as well, so without promotion to the young people then racing will be dead in the water. As someone said the average age of trackside viewers is people in their 60’s so the industry has a lot of work to do! Your theory,and it seems nearly everyone else's ,is that we need to target younger people to ensure future participation at all levels in the sport. Well i've heard that for the last 40 years. And that strategy hasn't worked has it. Its so bleeding obvious.How many more years do you think it will take before people realise this. And why is it having 2 20 year old people is more important than attracting 2 50 year olds. I know who is going to spend the more money. Nowdays the younger generation spend so much time sitting on their phones playing games that need no IQ. Instant gratification. I really don't know how you connect an interest in racing with those people and why you would bother. I've always believed a pathway to a racing interest has been exposure through family members such as parents/grandparents/workmates/sporting clubs. Thats how 99% of those i know who follow horse racing became involved.. I also think when they took away free to air tv it was one of the dumbest decisions ever made. So many people watched the sport because they found it interesting. They killed that exposure. Finding a motel with trackside is a rarity. Edited May 11, 2020 by the galah 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, the galah said: Your theory,and it seems nearly everyone else's ,is that we need to target younger people to ensure future participation at all levels in the sport. Well i've heard that for the last 40 years. And that strategy hasn't worked has it. Its so bleeding obvious.How many more years do you think it will take before people realise this. And why is it having 2 20 year old people is more important than attracting 2 50 year olds. I know who is going to spend the more money. Nowdays the younger generation spend so much time sitting on their phones playing games that need no IQ. Instant gratification. I really don't know how you connect an interest in racing with those people and why you would bother. I've always believed a pathway to a racing interest has been exposure through family members such as parents/grandparents/workmates/sporting clubs. Thats how 99% of those i know who follow horse racing became involved.. I also think when they took away free to air tv it was one of the dumbest decisions ever made. So many people watched the sport because they found it interesting. They killed that exposure. Finding a motel with trackside is a rarity. Galah, exactly my point! If people who are in their 20’s are not interested in racing now they probably won’t be when they are 40 years old. Therefore if these people aren’t coming thru then racing is dead in the water in years to come! I have been interested in harness racing since before I was 10 due to my mother and her father having a bit of an interest in racing. None of my children have any interest in racing whatsoever and probably never will. Believe it or not I have a few mates or acquaintances who also have children and none of them appear to be interested in racing either. This is a major problem that racing is going to encounter and you only need to see the number of young ones on course nowadays, apart from the industry participants. Personally speaking, even I haven’t attended on course as many meetings as I used to as if you can’t get a decent amount on, then I might as well stay at home and watch on Trackside, as the atmosphere is not there any longer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weasel Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 They don’t all of a sudden develop an interest in racing when they are in their 40’s and start punting on horses. oh yes they do ... two mates of mine discovered horse racing as owners in their 60s, hadnt been to a racetrack in decades. didnt know the difference between a hock and a hack 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 6 minutes ago, Brodie said: None of my children have any interest in racing whatsoever and probably never will Brodie mate you had/have a duty to your children... to get them hooked into racing for life. Led them to the kiddie tote. I don't care if your kids are now adults either, just do it. Tell them the number to say to the nice lady at the kiddie tote... if they are too shy, make them anyway. They can't have a choice in the matter, they must go to the races. My earliest memory in my life was at the races. Lotsa memories at the races. Never did me any harm. Apart from a life long adiction to feeding my habit, and now drowning in debt from owning very expensive pets, but apart from that... Now, I take my kids (pre-Covid19 days) there to the tracks and teach them all my vast knowledge... what to look for, how to read a racebook, betting strategies, horse bloodlines, drivers, trainers, how to stash the free sauce sachets and take them home, how to display appropriate behavior in public when your horse wins, or how to portion blame at others when the horse loses, all very valuable life skills. My youngest isn't even 2 years old yet, but she is going great guns so far... ya gotta get 'em early though, whilst they are still young and impressionable. Good luck mate, you can do it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 Lol, Rusty you are the type of enthusiast racing definitely need at the moment. Unfortunately the way things are going, I think racing as we know it is going to be dead in the water unless the government bails it out big time and that is doubtful with this government. They do not want business to be successful either do the big wigs at RITA or TAB! Would be interesting to have the TAB bosses actually tell us punters what they actually do each year for their salaries of up to $750k? As for my kids, no they will never be interested as they have other interests and they are fortunate that they do not need racing to support them. I have really enjoyed Harness Racing from a young age and for many years but it has been allowed to deteriorate for many years now unfortunately. This Covid19 has just sped things up dramatically and there are goi g to be one heck of a lot of people in the industry that are now going to need to contemplate their future. Owners are not going to continue to plough money into an industry where there is now no chance of a profit, where many now will need to plough this money into their business or their savings for retirement! Hopefully Brodie is totally wrong here and I would be more than happy to have egg on my face providing it is not too hot!!! Keep up the good work Rusty, and bring on the Addington racing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 The Right Honourable Winston Peters will be making a pre-budget announcement regarding the racing industry at midday today (Tuesday). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 20 minutes ago, Rusty said: The Right Honourable Winston Peters will be making a pre-budget announcement regarding the racing industry at midday today (Tuesday). I'll be very disappointed if he throws cash at the industry. Or fast tracks the stuffed up legislation. It would be acceptable if he offered to guarantee loans but not give loans interest free. If RITA can't raise money with a Government guarantee then what does that tell you? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 The turkeys at the top of RITA are very conspicuous by their absence! Where is this CEO of RITA, where is this clown Saville who will be on $750k close to that? What have they done for the benefit of the TAB and racing? Haven’t got a problem paying those salaries if the are worth it and add value, however they are have not shown any of it and should be on jobseeker benefit 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 10 hours ago, Rusty said: Now, I take my kids (pre-Covid19 days) there to the tracks and teach them all my vast knowledge... what to look for, how to read a racebook, betting strategies, horse bloodlines, drivers, trainers, how to stash the free sauce sachets and take them home, how to display appropriate behavior in public when your horse wins, or how to portion blame at others when the horse loses, all very valuable life skills. My youngest isn't even 2 years old yet, but she is going great guns so far... ya gotta get 'em early though, whilst they are still young and impressionable. I did the same (I've posted pictures recently on here). However as I was in a Rent-a-Kid situation and my child's mother was on a crusade to prove I was a 'bad' father for taking her to the races it eventually became harder to do. To the point where it was 'bad' to take her to my trainers property to see my horse and pat it. In that respect the NZRB/RITA and their marketing hasn't helped. They haven't positively marketed racing. I posted a video ad from Tabcorp on BOAY recently. TABCORP has an advertising campaign based on showing where their profits go and highlights everyday people that work in the industry. One theme of the campaign is "if you bet with TABCORP two and half times more more profit goes back to these people than if you bet with the bookies." Compare the advertising of Lotto in NZ. They constantly advertise that "All our profits go back to the community like....examples." What advertising do we get? "You know the odds now beat them." Or the latest one - "Can't make it to the local? You can still get on!" Do we see positive marketing on the Sports Betting? "When you bet with the TAB your favourite sport profits?" Even the Pokie Trusts turn what is a sad system of collecting gambling money from the vulnerable into positive advertising. What does the TAB do with its Pokie money? Funds the RIU. Not sure how you can positively spin that one! It even goes down to how we promote race meetings - I'm sick of seeing photoshopped glammed up women with a glass of champagne in their hand. While recently doing some research on the profitability of some racing clubs I visited one site that had such photos - they weren't even from their own race days! They were a mix of stock photos and paid talent. No wonder that club needs a Marketing AND an EVENT Manager and doesn't make a profit! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 46 minutes ago, Brodie said: The turkeys at the top of RITA are very conspicuous by their absence! Where is this CEO of RITA, where is this clown Saville who will be on $750k close to that? What have they done for the benefit of the TAB and racing? Haven’t got a problem paying those salaries if the are worth it and add value, however they are have not shown any of it and should be on jobseeker benefit No one is 'worth' even 400k per annum in a listed company or Govt enterprise. The 'going rate for talent' is just another construct,like 'trickle down' indoctrinated into minds, since the advent of voodoo economics that took hold in the 80's. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 32 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: No one is 'worth' even 400k per annum in a listed company or Govt enterprise. The 'going rate for talent' is just another construct,like 'trickle down' indoctrinated into minds, since the advent of voodoo economics that took hold in the 80's. Now who's gettting political! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 31 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Now who's gettting political! that's getting 'economical'...and usually following the tone set by site owners is advisable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 5 hours ago, Rusty said: The Right Honourable Winston Peters will be making a pre-budget announcement regarding the racing industry at midday today (Tuesday). So on a nutshell, he said the TAB would be broke (even moreso) by this coming Friday, so we (the government) are going to throw some coin their way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 23 minutes ago, Rusty said: So on a nutshell, he said the TAB would be broke (even moreso) by this coming Friday, so we (the government) are going to throw some coin their way. Correct. Insolvent is the term he used. They would not be able to pay their committments. I've posted those on the Gallops forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 Just now, Chief Stipe said: Correct. Insolvent is the term he used. They would not be able to pay their committments. I've posted those on the Gallops forum. Yes, sorry Chief, just saw that, thanks mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 So on that basis, why are the big wigs that have made stupid decisions, not fallen on their swords or acknowledged their shortcomings. If this was in the private sector these managers would be down the road, but as per usual the punters and taxpayers and horse participants are going to wear it. All the while these big wigs will be drawing their $10k per week salaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard Yardley Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 What an absolute disaster for the racing game. I trust those who had run the game into the ground over the past 20 odd years are sleeping well at nite. Unfortunately many of them are now overseas and should never have been brought into NZ. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 I just had a brainwave.With all this talk of helicopter money being dished out,the Gummint should give everybody with a TAB a/c as at midnight 12/05/2020 $1000 to bet with! What a great stimulus this would be.You could of course only withdraw winnings.( maybe set at at least $200.)? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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