Stakes

[curious]

17 July 2020

 

 

New Zealand Thoroughbred Racing (NZTR) announced today that stakes levels for the 2020/21 racing season will return to those in the 2019/20 season pre-COVID.

 

“The NZTR Board met yesterday and I am pleased to advise the wider industry that our stake levels were determined for the coming season,” NZTR CEO Bernard Saundry said.  “It is our intention that stakes levels will remain consistent with the pre-COVID levels, however we need to be aware that we continue to operate in an uncertain environment.”

 

“As an industry we need to be cognisant of the continuing uncertainties that COVID-19 has brought about and be nimble enough to make adjustments if required,” Saundry said.

 

“As a code we will work closely with the TAB to address any variations that may occur during the upcoming season,” he said.  “At the same time though, we need to provide encouragement for our owners, and we will be continuing with two initiatives introduced during our return to racing period in the new season.”

 

NZTR introduced payment back to 14th place and no nomination or acceptance fees for those horses which started at the return to racing meetings, as an acknowledgement of the difficult times experienced by owners during the lockdown period.  Both will continue from 1 August.

 

On the programming front, August and September will see the return of Maiden, 3YO and R65 races.  Programmes will still include Open Entry races to maximise opportunities for horses, however this will be reviewed throughout that period.

 

“NZTR acknowledges the support of the government and the Racing Industry Transition Agency (RITA) during these difficult times as we navigated the lockdown and post-COVID environment while also negotiating the passage of the Racing Industry Bill,” Saundry said.

[Joe Bloggs]

That's good news for our young trainer, he wont go to Oz now, however, where's the money coming from when you're broke? When you need to find 17 mil per annum before you put food on the table? How the hell are they funding these stakes, by sacking a few? C'mon......tell us the truth Bernard.

[Joe Bloggs]

Just mulling this over, as I bet many of you are,.......I've been self employed for 45 years, caught and killed my own, so, this is a conundrum, if you owed a fortune through incompetence and mismanagement and had to borrow to get you out of an unholy mess and your creditors who you have temporarily appeased have no confidence in you, how on earth can you continue in business?

Please put me out of my misery, Chief, Curious, Freda etc........if you lot don't know, how can I 3000km away?

[Chief Stipe]

From the actions (or inactions) I have seen to date the only way that they can maintain stake levels is to reduce the number of races or borrow more or sell assets (that they don't have).

[nomates]

43 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

From the actions (or inactions) I have seen to date the only way that they can maintain stake levels is to reduce the number of races or borrow more or sell assets (that they don't have).

The ever decreasing circle .

[Weasel]

3 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

From the actions (or inactions) I have seen to date the only way that they can maintain stake levels is to reduce the number of races or borrow more or sell assets (that they don't have).

and/or partner up with TABCORP or other Oz agency and get rid of their FOB platform/crap agreement

[Freda]

I saw a discussion elsewhere about the 'outsourcing '  apparently mentioned in the b/s from McKenzie in his valedictory press release.

The only reference to 'overseas content' that I can see  in that release is to BIUC money yet to come, as well as the PoC tax which will, I assume, hit everyone. The amounts to be realised from those sources would appear to be insignificant, given that the majority of overseas providers are already paying on a voluntary basis.

I don't get 'outsourcing' or 'partnering'  from that.

I emailed Saundry yesterday with some of my concerns, but have yet to receive a reply.

A fellow trainer told me yesterday that she spoke to him about the proposed race distances for the resumption,  she had issues with the intended 800m and 1000m events .  She said she found Bernard to be pleasant to speak to, and in the context of the conversation, he asked what a normal time frame might be for readying a horse to race.  She indicated that a period of about six weeks of conditioning work would be undertaken before speeding up to galloping.  And then,  he wanted to know, do you gallop every day?  At this point she was  lost for words.  As she pointed out to me, that is akin to the CEO of Fonterra thinking that milk was blue.

[Pitman]

Given the support by "TRAINERS' for 800m and 1000m races on resuming, I suggest you just ignore your fellow trainer

Edited July 17, 2020 by Pitman

[Huey]

57 minutes ago, Freda said:

I saw a discussion elsewhere about the 'outsourcing '  apparently mentioned in the b/s from McKenzie in his valedictory press release.

The only reference to 'overseas content' that I can see  in that release is to BIUC money yet to come, as well as the PoC tax which will, I assume, hit everyone. The amounts to be realised from those sources would appear to be insignificant, given that the majority of overseas providers are already paying on a voluntary basis.

I don't get 'outsourcing' or 'partnering'  from that.

I emailed Saundry yesterday with some of my concerns, but have yet to receive a reply.

A fellow trainer told me yesterday that she spoke to him about the proposed race distances for the resumption,  she had issues with the intended 800m and 1000m events .  She said she found Bernard to be pleasant to speak to, and in the context of the conversation, he asked what a normal time frame might be for readying a horse to race.  She indicated that a period of about six weeks of conditioning work would be undertaken before speeding up to galloping.  And then,  he wanted to know, do you gallop every day?  At this point she was  lost for words.  As she pointed out to me, that is akin to the CEO of Fonterra thinking that milk was blue.

That's an incredible comment and sums up the entire industry really. 

[Freda]

1 hour ago, Pitman said:

Given the support by "TRAINERS' for 800m and 1000m races on resuming, I suggest you just ignore your fellow trainer

Reported the comments to justify the phonecall made.  That is not the crux of my post, suggest you read it again.

[Noodlum]

1 hour ago, Pitman said:

Given the support by "TRAINERS' for 800m and 1000m races on resuming, I suggest you just ignore your fellow trainer

You lot training Quarter horses now?  Or would rather race for stakes than get your horses fit first?

[Joe Bloggs]

42 minutes ago, Freda said:

Reported the comments to justify the phonecall made.  That is not the crux of my post, suggest you read it again.

The blokes as thick as a plank, you're wasting your time Freda. #attritiontrainer.

[nomates]

1 hour ago, Huey said:

That's an incredible comment and sums up the entire industry really. 

All the more reason why people in his position should be having more consultation with industry participants about all aspects of NZ racing . I don't really mind that he doesn't know much about training racehorses , just wish he knew more about his own job .

[Noodlum]

8 minutes ago, nomates said:

I don't really mind that he doesn't know much about training racehorses , just wish he knew more about his own job .

FFS part of his job IS understanding how racehorses are trained.  I would have thought after he involvement in Victoria Racing he would know by now!  

[nomates]

13 minutes ago, Noodlum said:

FFS part of his job IS understanding how racehorses are trained. 

Why ? He's an administrator not a horse trainer . Should a hospital head administrator know the intricacies of how heart surgery works or should he just understand the costs associated with that surgery .

[Noodlum]

7 minutes ago, nomates said:

Should a hospital head administrator know the intricacies of how heart surgery works or should he just understand the costs associated with that surgery

That's half the problem with DHB administrators they know zilch about the clinical side - which is why I suggest they are crap managers.

I'm sure Freda and Pitty would appreciate their chosen careers being compared to that of a heart surgeon!

No disrespect to either of those two but training a horse isn't exactly rocket science.  If Saundry seriously didn't know how long it takes to get a horse race fit he was either taking the piss or should look for another job.

[nomates]

5 minutes ago, Noodlum said:

That's half the problem with DHB administrators they know zilch about the clinical side - which is why I suggest they are crap managers.

I'm sure Freda and Pitty would appreciate their chosen careers being compared to that of a heart surgeon!

No disrespect to either of those two but training a horse isn't exactly rocket science.  If Saundry seriously didn't know how long it takes to get a horse race fit he was either taking the piss or should look for another job.

Ok maybe we should asking why has he not gone out and found out more about the industry he is administering . As i said i don't care if he know's but if he doesn't then he needs to start surrounding himself with people who do .

And don't belittle training a horse too much , whilst i have known many a trainer try to convince people it is rocket science , it's not , but there is a science to it .

[Pitman]

2 hours ago, Noodlum said:

You lot training Quarter horses now?  Or would rather race for stakes than get your horses fit first?

I think our teams progressing ok given we don’t go to Rangiora trials and aren’t noted wet track trainers. They’re probably not as fit as some but they have been racing in races to suit where they are at in their preps and development.

[Noodlum]

11 minutes ago, nomates said:

And don't belittle training a horse too much , whilst i have known many a trainer try to convince people it is rocket science , it's not , but there is a science to it .

I'm not belittling training a horse.  I have been involved in hands on doing it.  My experience is the foundation to successful training of a horse is animal husbandry.  Keep the animal healthy while training it to maximise its potential.  That potential is largely genetic plus attitude.  Also identifying an individuals requirements and refining you overall techniques relative to that horse.  If Saundry doesn't know how long it takes to fit a horse then how can he even hope to schedule race meetings to meet demand.

[Noodlum]

4 minutes ago, Pitman said:

I think our teams progressing ok given we don’t go to Rangiora trials and aren’t noted wet track trainers. They’re probably not as fit as some but they have been racing in races to suit where they are at in their preps and development.

All good.  We can get away with that in NZ - harder in Australia.  Essentially using racing to get a horse to optimum fitness and maybe snagging a piece of a stake on the way.  Not exactly something the punters like but great if you are "close" to a stable!

[Joe Bloggs]

Well at least we know Saundry didn't race 90, I wonder if he's put his hand in his pocket to race any?  I'll send him a trainers handbook for a Chrissie Prezzie, you never know, his mates at the RIU might give him an owner trainers licence or if he's real lucky a No1......watch out Muzza and co, the premiership could be in danger.

[Huey]

5 hours ago, Noodlum said:

That's half the problem with DHB administrators they know zilch about the clinical side - which is why I suggest they are crap managers.

I'm sure Freda and Pitty would appreciate their chosen careers being compared to that of a heart surgeon!

No disrespect to either of those two but training a horse isn't exactly rocket science.  If Saundry seriously didn't know how long it takes to get a horse race fit he was either taking the piss or should look for another job.

I agree with you, All horses are different, but thinking you gallop them everyday just shows an utter state of ignorance.

[Joe Bloggs]

If you were hands on this industry and for some unfortunate reason needed or 'had' to have a meeting with Saundry, would you be instilled with confidence? If he did ask the question, do you gallop them everyday , wouldn't you ask him to resign? I would, anyone who thinks that shouldn't hold any position of influence in racing, I'm just aghast......God help us all.

[Joe Bloggs]

Gee there are some good posters on the 'other side', I hope Dr Herriot buggers off in pyjamas and his neutered lap dog is put down with distemper or Parvo as they might migrate then...to a far better site. The stakes clarity is a debacle and many are commenting on this.

Brian de Lore love or hate is quite correct in his latest summation, the way Petone avoid the elephant in the room is quite sad really, a poor reflection on them all, management level I mean, the creative writing is startling, they just can't bring themselves to tell the truth, therefore we are scaling down also, those able to 'read between the lines' with all their statements spruiking the road ahead, and in the same breath leaving an exit clause will realise this is doomed long term.

How can you plan a horses campaign unless you are prepared to fly by the seat of your pants, something NZTA/RITA have been doing for years, you'd also have to be happy to go with status quo, and unbelievably there are some that will do that. COVID19 is NOT responsible for racings woes, bad management is, and it's cost a lot of people their jobs.......but worse still, it's cost many their sanity, and in some cases I imagine much more,  if that's possible.

All in all, until we can trust, or I'll talk for myself and say, I can trust management of our industry to be honest, transparent and diligent in their dealings with people within our industry I can't bring myself to invest anymore in our industry where I and you are paying the salaries of many of these people......we've invested close to 2 million during the past 10 years, and no one expects to make money with horses, hope yes, expect no.......but to see the waste and mismanagement with no change in sight, only the same old same old....with a tweak here and there has brought us to a halt.

The loser will be the young fella that trains for us, like many he is doing it tough, so we'll not desert him, just look to how best we can benefit us, not the people that have brought the industry undone.

Finally, if China vetoes racing in HK, there will be an unemployment line stretching from Hamilton to Invercargill, the breeders and the bloodstock agents and the trading trainers will be devastated and eventually lost to the industry, so, the future looks pretty bleak sad to say. I hope for a miracle but at the moment the winners are the trainers here inheriting good horses from struggling trainers or desperate trainers and their owners across the ditch.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Joe Bloggs said:

Finally, if China vetoes racing in HK, there will be an unemployment line stretching from Hamilton to Invercargill, the breeders and the bloodstock agents and the trading trainers will be devastated and eventually lost to the industry, so, the future looks pretty bleak sad to say.

I can't see nor have I heard of China closing down racing in Hong Kong. With the substantial investment being made in new racing and training facilities on mainland China in recent years I cant see it happening.  Quite the reverse actually and that could have just as big an impact here.