Track - Riccarton Park-Canterbury JC | Saturday 14 November

[Joe Bloggs]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

Have to agree with both Pitty and Reefton about the watering producing uneven and biased track surfaces.

But, without having any pretensions to expertise in this matter - apart from years of observation  - there are vast differences in the surfaces we are offered for racing.

A fast track at Reefton is very different from the same at Riccarton, a fact that seems to escape many.  The soil structure at many tracks  (as alluded to by the Chief who does have knowledge in these matters) is stuffed, and therefore there is little that beleaguered track managers can do in these situations. 

Riccarton has such an unforgiving substructure that it is unacceptable to offer in unwatered state when firm - yet that watering creates a raft of problems. 

As Curious has pointed out, years of underinvestment has produced this situation that is going to be hugely costly to sort out.

As an aside - love your filly,  Reefton, she looks to have a bright future.

Here's a suggestion, Mills or his curator to call GCTC, ask for advice. We race here every Sat, a very harsh climate, 32 yesterday, they ran 1-8 and change, maidens running 1-9........rail out 10......but every Sat this track produces, so, the curator is either a genius or applies great common sense, with agriculture skills. All it takes is a call, like they should have done to Toowoomba as to why they uprooted their AWT........why grown men don't ask for help is beyond me, thats what my psychiatrist says anyways..... 

[Chief Stipe]

43 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said:

Here's a suggestion, Mills or his curator to call GCTC, ask for advice. We race here every Sat, a very harsh climate, 32 yesterday, they ran 1-8 and change, maidens running 1-9........rail out 10......but every Sat this track produces, so, the curator is either a genius or applies great common sense, with agriculture skills. All it takes is a call, like they should have done to Toowoomba as to why they uprooted their AWT........why grown men don't ask for help is beyond me, thats what my psychiatrist says anyways..... 

Ease up the Joe.  There are issues with the Gold Coast track hence the signalled upgrades.  Aren't they putting in a synthetic track on the inner during the first stage so they can continue to earn income and then they will work on the main track?

Dated March 2019 - 

Plans on the table include an equine tunnel, new synthetic training track and overhaul of the B Grass training track, plus Racing Queensland’s desire to install lights at the venue. There is an allocation of $28 million locked in for the Coast. A reconstruction of the course proper is part of the overall works, but Cook said the club would happily put that on the backburner if it meant the other projects could be started earlier.

[Freda]

'....new synthetic training track, overhaul of grass training track...reconstruction of course proper ...'

If only...and no mention of wiping out provincial clubs and tracks to facilitate this?  heavens above..

[Freda]

1 hour ago, Joe Bloggs said:

Here's a suggestion, Mills or his curator to call GCTC, ask for advice. We race here every Sat, a very harsh climate, 32 yesterday, they ran 1-8 and change, maidens running 1-9........rail out 10......but every Sat this track produces, so, the curator is either a genius or applies great common sense, with agriculture skills. All it takes is a call, like they should have done to Toowoomba as to why they uprooted their AWT........why grown men don't ask for help is beyond me, thats what my psychiatrist says anyways..... 

To be absolutely fair, the kikuyu-type grass with its spreading root system  [ a bit like twitch, I was told ]  used in Qld is very different from the rye grass cultivars in use here.

Just try and get rid of twitch from your garden, origin under the neighbour's fence, and you will get the point.

I believe a similar type is also used in Tokyo, certainly in the Horlicks time, the grass looked discoloured and unattractive, but apparently still offered resilient cushion.

 

Edited November 14, 2020 by Freda

[Reefton]

18 hours ago, Running Man said:

what a joke pitty says track is slow and they ran  122

sore loser obviously cream is rising  to the top 4 for tangerine

Looking at the breeding and the names a lot of the owning syndicates Te Akau had there yesterday they would want to win a race or two.  When the words 'Breeding Syndicate' appear in rhe ownership one immediately knows they paid top top dollar and when said horse is no longer in possession of his testicles one sort of cringes at the thought of how far down the drain financially the syndicate is. Not to mention the purchase price of a couple they are not taking home with them.

For all that the Richards are wonderful people and I admire David Ellis' capabilities in terms of salesmanship but a bit of perspective indicates they should be dominant given the quality of the bloodlines they work with.

[Reefton]

2 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

Or after 28 races by the time it got to the Welcome Stakes it was worn.

If your theory about irrigation was correct then explain the first day that showed no apparent bias yet had far more irrigation?

Also 48mm was applied by God and 8mm by the Track Manager.  I suggest Reefton you go to confession after Mass this morning and ask why the man upstairs decided to disadvantage your horse.

I have been to Mass this morning as a matter of fact but when you say the 'man upstairs' well I would say it was M Cameron (who wasn't that far upstairs to be fair) who chose to disadvantage me by diving for rhe rail.  Although in his slight defence the horse outside him did appear to be laying all over her at the time.  But by that stage everyone knew the inside was a dud lane so it is puzzling he choose that route. Still I couldn't ride one around the birdcage so I am not too grumpy.

[Chief Stipe]

Yes many jockey's adjusted their tactics and positioned themselves before the top of the straight.  However in my opinion the track was only "off" where it was worn.  There were still horses making ground 3 horse widths out from the fence as the day progressed and winning.

As I said in an earlier post I don't know why they didn't have the rail out 3m the whole circuit.  LOL I guess then you'd have people complaining that the inside was a fast lane!

[Reefton]

4 hours ago, Freda said:

Have to agree with both Pitty and Reefton about the watering producing uneven and biased track surfaces.

But, without having any pretensions to expertise in this matter - apart from years of observation  - there are vast differences in the surfaces we are offered for racing.

A fast track at Reefton is very different from the same at Riccarton, a fact that seems to escape many.  The soil structure at many tracks  (as alluded to by the Chief who does have knowledge in these matters) is stuffed, and therefore there is little that beleaguered track managers can do in these situations. 

Riccarton has such an unforgiving substructure that it is unacceptable to offer in unwatered state when firm - yet that watering creates a raft of problems. 

As Curious has pointed out, years of underinvestment has produced this situation that is going to be hugely costly to sort out.

As an aside - love your filly,  Reefton, she looks to have a bright future.

Thanks Pam.  I like her too though I worry a little that that was a tough run yesterday and hope it doesn't affect her attitude.  It was a bloody hot day and while I don't get too close to too many horses immediately after their races these days she was absolutely awash with sweat. Clearly tried her guts out.

She is a half sister to an earlier one we a lot of fun with The Governator.  And those with good memories will recall him running there days in a week at Trentham at the Cup meeting seven or so years ago on rock hard tracks that everyone was bleating about. Ran third the first day and won on the second and third.  Pitty knows how to get them handling the concrete!

[Chief Stipe]

I wouldn't worry about her being a "free sweater".  My best was.  I remember the day of her Group win we had to scrape her down twice before we got to the birdcage!

Physiologically it is a plus because they cool quicker than those that don't.  I'd be a bit more worried of a horse that didn't sweat up on a day like yesterday because it may indicate dehydration.  If they are sweating but not excited - all good.

I was listening to Jayne Ivil's comments pre start at Newcastle yesterday and she mentioned that some breeds do it more than others e.g. the Galileo's.

[Huey]

51 minutes ago, Reefton said:

Looking at the breeding and the names a lot of the owning syndicates Te Akau had there yesterday they would want to win a race or two.  When the words 'Breeding Syndicate' appear in rhe ownership one immediately knows they paid top top dollar and when said horse is no longer in possession of his testicles one sort of cringes at the thought of how far down the drain financially the syndicate is. Not to mention the purchase price of a couple they are not taking home with them.

For all that the Richards are wonderful people and I admire David Ellis' capabilities in terms of salesmanship but a bit of perspective indicates they should be dominant given the quality of the bloodlines they work with.

Couple that with the best jockeys on tap and a model that allows the TA trainer to concentrate on training the animal and is it any wonder they have days like this? 

Still a great achievement by the young man in charge and he certainly seems to take it all in his stride. 

[Joe Bloggs]

2 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

Ease up the Joe.  There are issues with the Gold Coast track hence the signalled upgrades.  Aren't they putting in a synthetic track on the inner during the first stage so they can continue to earn income and then they will work on the main track?

Dated March 2019 - 

Plans on the table include an equine tunnel, new synthetic training track and overhaul of the B Grass training track, plus Racing Queensland’s desire to install lights at the venue. There is an allocation of $28 million locked in for the Coast. A reconstruction of the course proper is part of the overall works, but Cook said the club would happily put that on the backburner if it meant the other projects could be started earlier.

I'm not saying it's perfect Chief, our velvet track is so so and needs work, that begins this week, the sand is brilliant and the b grass needs work, we get the course proper most weeks, restricted of course, and there are lights going in so we can have night racing in a place that will support night racing and it will flourish.

The problem being though, the socialist government has been promising this 30mil upgrade for years, they just bull shitted and lip serviced, the last election wasn't even close, the LIBS are pathetic except for a few local members who swim against the tide.

We have a new racing minister too, the previous paper tiger has gone, and wowie up steps none other than Grace Grace, yep, Grace Grace......what, been to the races half a dozen times if she's lucky........just like that useless oxygen thief Nathan Cry......but I'm waffle;ing, in all reality even in it's worn condition our track is a beauty, they can come from back, the cutaway gives you a chance off the leaders heels, and the irrigation is well managed and so appreciated........if this track can take the racing it does and delivers like DHL......then it's human error in NZ, it must be, prove me wrong.....politely.

[Reefton]

1 hour ago, Huey said:

Couple that with the best jockeys on tap and a model that allows the TA trainer to concentrate on training the animal and is it any wonder they have days like this? 

Still a great achievement by the young man in charge and he certainly seems to take it all in his stride. 

He certainly is a great young man and he comes from a great set of parents.  But for all that that job would come with immense pressure and responsibility and he handles it beautifully.  The TA hype might irritate me but you still have to admire the goals they set and the way they strive to achieve them

[Cecil]

5 hours ago, Reefton said:

He certainly is a great young man and he comes from a great set of parents.  But for all that that job would come with immense pressure and responsibility and he handles it beautifully.  The TA hype might irritate me but you still have to admire the goals they set and the way they strive to achieve them

The inside was definitely off and rail should have been out. This happened on the Wednesday last year so they didn’t learn their lesson. Jamie a great young trainer but I thought Karen very unimpressive the way she strutted and performed in the birdcage. Five wins is an amazing effort but so is being respectful. If Albert Bowman carried on like she did yesterday he would be called a wan%#”er.

[Cecil]

Bosma

[Huey]

35 minutes ago, Cecil said:

The inside was definitely off and rail should have been out. This happened on the Wednesday last year so they didn’t learn their lesson. Jamie a great young trainer but I thought Karen very unimpressive the way she strutted and performed in the birdcage. Five wins is an amazing effort but so is being respectful. If Albert Bowman carried on like she did yesterday he would be called a wan%#”er.

Have to agree they do seem to get away with a lot more than other stables.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Cecil said:

The inside was definitely off and rail should have been out. This happened on the Wednesday last year so they didn’t learn their lesson. Jamie a great young trainer but I thought Karen very unimpressive the way she strutted and performed in the birdcage. Five wins is an amazing effort but so is being respectful. If Albert Bowman carried on like she did yesterday he would be called a wan%#”er.

Were you on course or watching on TV?

The reason why I ask is because Trackside tends to gravitate towards Te Akau.  Which is not surprising when you consider that she trained most of the presenters, David Ellis resurrected Weigh In and Karen does a lot of the syndicate admin and looking after people.

Plus 5 winners and you tend to get a bit of airtime.  You'll probably find she had shares in some of them so I'd be prancing around as well.

[Freda]

5 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Were you on course or watching on TV?

Plushenko strode home impressively along the fence.....just saying...

[Chief Stipe]

2 minutes ago, Freda said:

Plushenko strode home impressively along the fence.....just saying...

Yep.  Wasn't the only one.  

[Cecil]

57 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Were you on course or watching on TV?

The reason why I ask is because Trackside tends to gravitate towards Te Akau.  Which is not surprising when you consider that she trained most of the presenters, David Ellis resurrected Weigh In and Karen does a lot of the syndicate admin and looking after people.

Plus 5 winners and you tend to get a bit of airtime.  You'll probably find she had shares in some of them so I'd be prancing around as well.

I was oncourse. I realise she is all personality etc but there was a falseness to it. Strappers lined up to attention during 

races. Another young lady running around joyously over the top with a camera seemed to be connected to them.

I have no beef with them at all and sure it was a big day but in my opinion they lack class.

[Chief Stipe]

23 minutes ago, Cecil said:

I have no beef with them at all and sure it was a big day but in my opinion they lack class.

You have no beef with them yet insult them by saying they have no class.

[the galah]

4 hours ago, Cecil said:

I was oncourse. I realise she is all personality etc but there was a falseness to it. Strappers lined up to attention during 

races. Another young lady running around joyously over the top with a camera seemed to be connected to them.

I have no beef with them at all and sure it was a big day but in my opinion they lack class.

I once worked with her for a short time some time ago.. I thought she was very down to earth and just a nice lady. Didn't seem pretentious at all. I sometimes read these comments and think they are a bit unkind. I guess if they didn't win as many they would not be on the tv so much. 

[Running Man]

23 hours ago, Freda said:

To be absolutely fair, the kikuyu-type grass with its spreading root system  [ a bit like twitch, I was told ]  used in Qld is very different from the rye grass cultivars in use here.

Just try and get rid of twitch from your garden, origin under the neighbour's fence, and you will get the point.

I believe a similar type is also used in Tokyo, certainly in the Horlicks time, the grass looked discoloured and unattractive, but apparently still offered resilient cushion.

 

kikuyu doesn't like cold frost wouldn't grow in Canterbury

[Running Man]

13 hours ago, Freda said:

Plushenko strode home impressively along the fence.....just saying...

but it couldn't have because rail was off so experts said

[Running Man]

On 11/15/2020 at 6:58 AM, Chief Stipe said:

Or after 28 races by the time it got to the Welcome Stakes it was worn.

If your theory about irrigation was correct then explain the first day that showed no apparent bias yet had far more irrigation?

Also 48mm was applied by God and 8mm by the Track Manager.  I suggest Reefton you go to confession after Mass this morning and ask why the man upstairs decided to disadvantage your horse.

hang on a minute 81mls irrigation and 16mls rain leading into first day jockeys raved about the track so how can 8mls irrigation ruin the track????  

8mls irrigation Thursday night and he says irrigation ruin his cup week WTF

Every jockey said track was worn due to that much traffic but was presented in great order considering the amount of races actually didn't Lisa Allpress say after Plushneko won on the rail that of all the time coming to Riccarton that the track was the best its been EVER?????

 

  the rail was off due to wear and tear from 28 races like you said

try having that many horses and that many races and tell me what track wouldn't be off on rail 

[Freda]

1 hour ago, Running Man said:

kikuyu doesn't like cold frost wouldn't grow in Canterbury

Yes, I realise it is a tropical or subtropical species.

But Tokyo would have periods of cold, so, maybe a specific cultivar that can cope?