Kumara

[Tesio]

54 minutes ago, nomates said:

What resources ? 

I get it you don't want to travel your horses , but many are happy to , that's owners money not industry money . So again no harm , no foul . These meeting serve a purpose , no , many purposes .

These meetings in many ways garner more money on a cost / return basis for the industry than a large portion of the big days , but that's fine that is their job , they're not complaining . 

The only ones complaining are the ones that want to get their hands on the cash .

I have had this debate with many with your argument and i always ask the same question , but i'm still waiting , no one can give me any idea of the figures that it is costing the industry , not even the head office who are promoting the argument , so at the moment the argument for closure is redundant .

I ask again , what resources , what is the cost to the industry to prop up these lame ducks .

I wait in anticipation .

Maybe you should study the horse population numbers......what does the past 10yr trend tell you. And while you are studying....look up ‘opportunity cost’.

[Huey]

36 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said:

How many of these industry terrorists will still be in this industry in say 5 or 10 years Huey? You reckon that Aussie bloke will still be kicking back admiring the view over the harbour from his office in the Taj Mahal? or some of the other suits with little between the left and right ears? Nah, they'll wander off into the sunset, damage done......how's it go again, all care, no responsibility?....in fact, no care no responsibility more like it.

Agree with you JB, they don't care an iota about the industry , they happy pleasing a handful of participants, thats all that will be left once they are finished with it.

[Chief Stipe]

11 minutes ago, Tesio said:

Maybe you should study the horse population numbers......what does the past 10yr trend tell you. And while you are studying....look up ‘opportunity cost’.

So building AWT's to "avoid lost revenue from abandoned meetings" is pointless?  Because there aren't enough horses anyway?

[nomates]

8 minutes ago, Tesio said:

Maybe you should study the horse population numbers......what does the past 10yr trend tell you. And while you are studying....look up ‘opportunity cost’.

Why should i study to get your argument , answer the question . Your doing what everyone else in your position does instead of answers , smoke and mirrors . 

I was working in Matamata during early / ,mid 80's , horses numbers big then , still big , nothings changed there , numbers down in other parts of the country , sure , because of bad policy . 

So your answer is rather than bring in policy that starts getting those horse numbers up and reinvigorate the industries in those regions is to just retrench to where the current numbers are big . 

You have as little idea about getting the industry back up and strong as our current leaders 

[Tesio]

7 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

So building AWT's to "avoid lost revenue from abandoned meetings" is pointless?  Because there aren't enough horses anyway?

I agree with your Chief. But i do believe Cambridge needed one for training and trialing benefits. Awapuni. No, waste of money. Riccarton, i lend towards no not exactly needed, but will have benefits for trainers at Riccarton.

[Tesio]

11 minutes ago, nomates said:

Why should i study to get your argument , answer the question . Your doing what everyone else in your position does instead of answers , smoke and mirrors . 

I was working in Matamata during early / ,mid 80's , horses numbers big then , still big , nothings changed there , numbers down in other parts of the country , sure , because of bad policy . 

So your answer is rather than bring in policy that starts getting those horse numbers up and reinvigorate the industries in those regions is to just retrench to where the current numbers are big . 

You have as little idea about getting the industry back up and strong as our current leaders 

It’s not smoke and mirrors Nomates....you asked “what is the cost to the industry to prop up these lame ducks”...i gave you the response....horse numbers. Owners are exiting in droves....THAT IS THE COST!

[nomates]

7 minutes ago, Tesio said:

It’s not smoke and mirrors Nomates....you asked “what is the cost to the industry to prop up these lame ducks”...i gave you the response....horse numbers. Owners are exiting in droves....THAT IS THE COST!

What the feck has horse numbers got to do with it , most of the small tracks  have never had large numbers , doesn't/haven't stopped them having a meeting . 

I want the cost to the industry , not the cost to individual owners , you opt not to travel , others have the same option .

They are not exiting in droves because of the cost of travelling , it's for what you say you wont travel for , crap stakes . 

So again what is the financial cost to the industry , your argument for closing them , not to individual owners .

So if you get your wish for a significant closure of tracks , prey tell me how much the savings , roughly , will be for the industry and how much that saving will increase stakes .

I'll give you an inkling , fuck all .

[nomates]

15 minutes ago, Tesio said:

It’s not smoke and mirrors Nomates....you asked “what is the cost to the industry to prop up these lame ducks”...i gave you the response....horse numbers. Owners are exiting in droves....THAT IS THE COST!

You must be part of the NZTR brains trust if you honestly think that closing tracks is going to be the panacea for the return of owners to racehorse ownership . It's naive enough of an idea to have come out of head office .

The call used to be " build it and they will come " , but no now it's " close them , they will return . 

[Tesio]

1 minute ago, nomates said:

What the feck has horse numbers got to do with it , most of the small tracks  have never had large numbers , doesn't/haven't stopped them having a meeting . 

I want the cost to the industry , not the cost to individual owners , you opt not to travel , others have the same option .

They are not exiting in droves because of the cost of travelling , it's for what you say you wont travel for , crap stakes . 

So again what is the financial cost to the industry , your argument for closing them , not to individual owners .

So if you get your wish for a significant closure of tracks , prey tell me how much the savings , roughly , will be for the industry and how much that saving will increase stakes .

I'll give you an inkling , fuck all .

Nomates.....if you cant piece together what horse numbers and reducing owner numbers has to do with THE COST TO THE INDUSTRY....then debating with you is a complete waste of time. Take those Te Akau blinkers off.

[nomates]

10 minutes ago, Tesio said:

Nomates.....if you cant piece together what horse numbers and reducing owner numbers has to do with THE COST TO THE INDUSTRY....then debating with you is a complete waste of time. Take those Te Akau blinkers off.

Owner numbers has nothing to do with closing tracks , what part of it don't you get , they are getting out because of piss poor returns in the shape of stakes and the cost of getting a horse trained in relation to those stakes . 

You can close all the tracks bar 6/7 majors and it wont change ownership numbers , they wont come rolling back into ownership because they have to have their horse trained at one of those tracks remaining . 

Stakes need to increase , massively , simple equation although you are starting to behave a bit like a computer now . Get base stakes up so returns to owners increase substantially to offset training costs . That and that alone will get ownership up . Now if you don't get that then don't bother replying because your starting to give me an idea of what having hemorrhiods must be like .

Got no idea what the Te Akau reference is about , got no affiliation with them .

[Tesio]

2 minutes ago, nomates said:

Owner numbers has nothing to do with closing tracks , what part of it don't you get , they are getting out because of piss poor returns in the shape of stakes and the cost of getting a horse trained in relation to those stakes . 

You can close all the tracks bar 6/7 majors and it wont change ownership numbers , they wont come rolling back into ownership because they have to have their horse trained at one of those tracks remaining . 

Stakes need to increase , massively , simple equation although you are starting to behave a bit like a computer now . Get base stakes up so returns to owners increase substantially to offset training costs . That and that alone will get ownership up . Now if you don't get that then don't bother replying because your starting to give me an idea of what having hemorrhiods must be like .

Got no idea what the Te Akau reference is about , got no affiliation with them .

Wow......stakes need to increase .........gee that’s a news flash.... clap clap.......

Any by the way owner numbers have everything to do with needing to close some tracks...... you keep kicking the can down the road and lets just agree to disagree 

[Shad]

Old story what happens when you cut off any sports at the grassroots level.

[Bid]

2 hours ago, Tesio said:

 I’m sure greymouth people can get in the car and go to Kumara or vers......

 

 

But they don't. They might the first year after there track shuts down, they may even be tempted the following year, but each year the numbers will become less and in 10 years time that region will be lost to industry. Kids haven't been dragged along by parents/grandparents and got hooked on the game and in time there won't be any punters left who fund the sport. 

Take something away from people they'll just find another hobby to fill the void. 

[nomates]

5 minutes ago, Bid said:

But they don't. They might the first year after there track shuts down, they may even be tempted the following year, but each year the numbers will become less and in 10 years time that region will be lost to industry. Kids haven't been dragged along by parents/grandparents and got hooked on the game and in time there won't be any punters left who fund the sport. 

Take something away from people they'll just find another hobby to fill the void. 

There will plenty of people where the horses are tho , so all good .

[curious]

We are wasting our time groaning. As Pitty said " They reap what they sow,"

[Freda]

We all 'reap what we sow'  in some shape or form,  success, failure,  illness, injury, everything that happens  in life is  a result of decisions made, one way or another.

Racing is no different, obviously.

However, I don't think the demise of Hokitika as a racing venue can be put squarely at the feet of the club and its decisions - if, in fact, that is what you meant, C.

[curious]

1 hour ago, Freda said:

We all 'reap what we sow'  in some shape or form,  success, failure,  illness, injury, everything that happens  in life is  a result of decisions made, one way or another.

Racing is no different, obviously.

However, I don't think the demise of Hokitika as a racing venue can be put squarely at the feet of the club and its decisions - if, in fact, that is what you meant, C.

I wasn't referring to the Hokitika club. I was rederring to those that caused the club to take that action.

 

[Huey]

16 hours ago, Tesio said:

Nomates.....if you cant piece together what horse numbers and reducing owner numbers has to do with THE COST TO THE INDUSTRY....then debating with you is a complete waste of time. Take those Te Akau blinkers off.

So your solution is to kick everyone who doesn't train at Cambridge, Riccarton ,Awapuni or Pukekohe to the kerb? 

Reducing venues will not sustain or increase horse numbers, if that was the case why are country/picnic venues still a huge part of Aus racing? 

Please don't tell me you think like NZTR,  in that the horses trained elsewhere will just magically turn up at these venues they are favouring, it won't happen. 

At any rate the demise has begun in haste and a once great industry will soon only be a shadow of its former self. 

[curious]

It's already only a shadow of its former self

[Chief Stipe]

20 minutes ago, Huey said:

Please don't tell me you think like NZTR,  in that the horses trained elsewhere will just magically turn up at these venues they are favouring, it won't happen. 

Why would they move from a low cost environment to a high cost one?  Will we see Pitman doth protest loudly when Riccarton track fees rapidly climb to pay for the new training track?

[Freda]

53 minutes ago, curious said:

I wasn't referring to the Hokitika club. I was rederring to those that caused the club to take that action.

 

Yes,  of course.  Absolutely.

[Freda]

29 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Why would they move from a low cost environment to a high cost one?  Will we see Pitman doth protest loudly when Riccarton track fees rapidly climb to pay for the new training track?

The work starts this week on the new AWT.

[Chief Stipe]

5 minutes ago, Freda said:

The work starts this week on the new AWT.

To be honest Freda I'm more worried where the industry is going to find the $41 million they were short last year this year.

NZTR seems to be by stealth implementing a new computer system.  Already spent $1 million on it.  We all know the history of computer system cosy blow-outs.  You'll see staff numbers and costs go up at NZTR because of the devolving of functions from the NZRB.  

You'll also see staff numbers and costs go up at Riccarton from next week onwards.

Saundry will be working like crazy on the asset grab!

[Huey]

Just now, Chief Stipe said:

 

Saundry will be working like crazy on the asset grab!

I hear it is well underway. 

[Huey]

41 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Why would they move from a low cost environment to a high cost one?  Will we see Pitman doth protest loudly when Riccarton track fees rapidly climb to pay for the new training track?

Because they do not have a fundamental understanding of how the sport really operates,  what they see at Ellerslie & Riccarton during carnivals is how they think it is.