Mick Guerin - 20 Track Closures?

[Ludwig]

Why close Roxburgh.? An iconic summer meeting with the apricots. Good fields, well attended. Save the industry by closing popular destinations...bizarre 

[JJ Flash]

14 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

I bet you McKenzie isn't doing the job for nothing.

Nor , should he or anyone else for that matter. You seem obsessed with the half yearly report. Are you running out of ammo to moan about???

 

Greg

[Chief Stipe]

7 minutes ago, JJ Flash said:

Nor , should he or anyone else for that matter. You seem obsessed with the half yearly report. Are you running out of ammo to moan about???

 

Greg

Hardly running out of ammo.  More being produced by the same old same old crew.  But if we had the half yearly report as has been the case for over 20 years we could have informed debate.  Especially in this new era of transparency. 

[Happy Sunrise]

15 minutes ago, Ludwig said:

Why close Roxburgh.?

Interesting to have 2 meetings at Cromwell.

Can't be distance due to it being near enough to Omakau and Cromwell. They might be emphasizing the grass track aspect to get more horses. I have felt the whole 3 meeting in 6 days has battled recently. Less and less Canterbury horses go down there but the 2 day aspect might encourage more to go as it offers two bites of the central cherry.

That said, Roxburgh had a special place in harness. 

I just wish RITA would explain themselves fully  so people could understand the logic of their decisions. Is there any explanation anywhere? 

[the galah]

So they have announced which clubs will be closed as racing venues. I understand the need for centralisation.

But does anyone know what happens to the venues as regards remaining open as training facilities? Where is the announcement about that. Should that not have been made at the same time? 

Take the likes of horses trained in South Canterbury.  Orari, Waimate and Timaru gone as racing venues but you would think they must retain one of those as a training facility otherwise they would lose about 100 horses( thoroughbred or standardbred) who use those tracks .

If those tracks close, trainers in that area would have no tracks to train from unless there was significant travel each day. A couple of the bigger trainers would have to make 2 round trips,totaling about 4 hours all up, thus incurring significant travel and extra wage costs.  Given the time and cost involved you would expect none of those to continue if the tracks were closed.  The owners would be gone as well. 

The Oamaru track is an interesting one.  It appears to have remained open,yet there is not 1 thoroughbred trained there. And only  a dozen or so harness horses,half of which have trainers in their seventies. Williamson may turn up now and again to give his horses a run but he has his own training track,unlike those in south canterbury.  And of course 80% of the horses that race there from both codes drive past Timaru to get to Oamaru.

So  i hope they clarify quickly which tracks are to remain as training facilities. That way those training from there can pull the pin sooner rather than later.

The other obvious question is if they do retain some courses as training tracks who pays for their upkeep given the funding they receive from their local racing clubs will no longer be there.

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, JJ Flash said:

Stop confusing  current  salaries as being something RITA introduced which is and has been my base case for not bagging them.. Those in the management team had their salaries decided way before RITA took over. We are talking Allen and Glenda here and some before then.

Can you or anyone tell us what the current CEO is on?? I did not think so.J Allen was 750K according to some figures i have seen quoted and both he and CFO have departed

I am almost certain that the RITA board will be looking to downsize management team in the near future but with a thing called Employment Contracts Act  you cant just cut salaries . You would need to carry out  restructuring which is both a timely and expensive process from a redundancy point of view. That may well be what is currently going on

 

Greg

Greg, so you are saying that there are big wigs there that have had their salaries reduced sufficiently in line with their true value?

Greg, why have these CEO’s been on such big salaries when they have offered nothing!

Watched the AGM last year when John Allen was on stage wanking on what the is betting platform was going to do for NZ racing and all about how great they were.

Without the owners, trainers and punters there wouldn’t be racing obviously, and this plonker was taking  $15,000 each and every week for making stupid decisions, and everyone else around him should have to walk the plank without Compensation for backing his decisions.

Dean McKenzie has stated that they need increased turnover , but that is not what plonker Allen, plonker Saville were wanting!!!!!

They wanted to better the TAB yield, which Brodie has been saying for years was a flawed Business plan!

Yes, I know, everyone will be saying that Brodie is always on the money!!

 

[the galah]

I have just read that the thoroughbreds will still race at  Timaru,just no trots. Not sure why they would keep a racecourse open for one code only,seems a bit of a strange decision. I guess that answers my own questions. 

Edited May 15, 2020 by the galah

[Wobbler]

1 hour ago, Ludwig said:

Which would be the nearest course to you when this takes effect?

Oamaru for 6 meetings on all weather(Where has Kurow gone,cause they raced  there?) and 3 on grass ,but got no grasstrackers ,

so next then it looks like Addington ,three hours away ,and hope like hell that there going to cater for the lower grade horses , as Forbury

did for us ,and not select fields highest to lowest like they do now (Andrew Morris if you read these pages)

[Happy Sunrise]

12 minutes ago, the galah said:

Timaru,just no trots.

Timaru fields are more similar to Forbury than anywhere else and are probably under performing in the betting stakes.

The gallops had to be kept because of the statue lol.

[Happy Sunrise]

39 minutes ago, the galah said:

But does anyone know what happens to the venues as regards remaining open as training facilities? Where is the announcement about that. Should that not have been made at the same time? 

Take the likes of horses trained in South Canterbury.  Orari, Waimate and Timaru gone as racing venues but you would think they must retain one of those as a training facility otherwise they would lose about 100 horses( thoroughbred or standardbred) who use those tracks .

Those are the questions that have to be answered by RITA and HRNZ or do they see it as collateral damage and  no major loss?

 

[the galah]

Just now, Happy Sunrise said:

Timaru fields are more similar to Forbury than anywhere else and are probably under performing in the betting stakes.

The gallops had to be kept because of the statue lol.

If the quality of fields was a factor in turnover, then why did the latest Waimate meeting  have such a huge off course turnover?    The answer is its never been all about quality, thats just what they want you to believe.

[OLDWHITEMAN]

21 hours ago, Brodie said:

Unfortunately talking about what tracks are going to close, who is getting redundancy is really a red herring!

I don’t think people in the industry including Winston Peters, realise how dire the situation has become due to mismanagement!

If this was a private business it would now be in receivership and I believe that is what will eventually happen in the next year or two.

Unless the government is going  to continue to throw money at Racing in NZ  then yes It will go into receivership or management of some sort.

The $70m includes $20m for the artificial tracks which I think is money down the drain now!!

Of the $50m there is another $26m or so to go back to their Bank as some FUCKWITS borrowed And now they also have a $17m yearly contingency,  not sure whether this is each and every year, if it is they have to get out of this quick smart.

Effectively they have roughly $20m left from the $70m and how much of this is going to dissappear in redundancies, probably most!

There is no radio coverage, next to no presenters, no form guides apart from online, 

next to no tracks, but yes we will have wall to wall racing from Oz, Dubai, Japan,Budapest, Zimbabwe, Argentina, Tonga, etc etc.

We can bet on our iPads and into a self service machine and no,TAB agencies!!!

The stakes are going to be $5k on a very good day as turnover is going to be dwindling!

These big wigs who draw these exorbitant salaries have stuffed the racing industry as they have no idea on how to run a successful business, as most have always had their noses in the public troughs!!

We will all have to get another interest!

Some won’t agree with the Brodster but as you all know, I am always on the money” unfortunately on this occasion!

On the money mate.

I can see the day when Addington will be the only track holding harness racing regularly and that day is not far away. NZMet will be able to afford to carry on because of the piss-up "look at me" NZ Trotting Cup day to subsidise the rest of the season. Stakes won't be as high as now but the club will continue but it will like a small cottage industry. Just a few local trainers winning most races and probably little on-course or off-course turnover.

[Happy Sunrise]

34 minutes ago, the galah said:

If the quality of fields was a factor in turnover, then why did the latest Waimate meeting  have such a huge off course turnover?    The answer is its never been all about quality, thats just what they want you to believe.

Waimate was a Sunday. Timaru races on random weekdays.

[Happy Sunrise]

36 minutes ago, the galah said:

If the quality of fields was a factor in turnover, then why did the latest Waimate meeting  have such a huge off course turnover?    The answer is its never been all about quality, thats just what they want you to believe.

I think there is a difference sometimes. I used to bet on Forbury quite a bit but in recent times it has got harder and harder because of either a dominant favourite with a formline of 687X94 against similar horses or a Cran Dalgety first starter paying $1.40. At a guess, I would say the fields are smaller in recent times too and I would say fewer and fewer Canterbury horses go down now.

Waimate, had competitive and big fields. The value was there to be had. Eg Kiwi X Factor winning at 8s after a very tidy trial win at Rangiora from memory. 

I don't bet into quality races like the NZ Cup. I prefer the lower stuff but sometimes the fields at Timaru and Forbury present very little in the way of punting.

[holy ravioli]

some of those country class ,grass trot meets...were diabolical from a punters perspective...the trotting standing starts were the biggest lottery in NZ.

Harness could probably survive and thrive with 1/2 dozen tracks max imo.

[the galah]

3 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

I think there is a difference sometimes. I used to bet on Forbury quite a bit but in recent times it has got harder and harder because of either a dominant favourite with a formline of 687X94 against similar horses or a Cran Dalgety first starter paying $1.40. At a guess, I would say the fields are smaller in recent times too and I would say fewer and fewer Canterbury horses go down now.

Waimate, had competitive and big fields. The value was there to be had. Eg Kiwi X Factor winning at 8s after a very tidy trial win at Rangiora from memory. 

I don't bet into quality races like the NZ Cup. I prefer the lower stuff but sometimes the fields at Timaru and Forbury present very little in the way of punting.

It doesn't matter where  they are running. Punters don't like races where there are  dominant favorites like we used to get when they had all those penalty free races. Those penalty free races so often had about 25 nominate and then end up with 7  acceptors with a hot favorite. 

Waimate's pre lockdown meeting turnover was huge and clearly illustrated betting is more about exposure and having even fields with a bit of form.  It was a low grade meeting but  that will never put punters off if the fields are attractive.  

Had an auckland premier meeting been run under the same circumstances people would not have bet on it anywhere near to the same extent.   NZ cup day has all the ingredients that waimate had,except higher quality. Run waimate fields at addington on cup day with the same pre race coverage, and the turnover would not be too dissimilar. Its only the media that tell us otherwise. In your answer happy you said as much as well. 

[Shad]

Has the March racing on the coast been dropped to.

[JJ Flash]

10 hours ago, Brodie said:

Greg, so you are saying that there are big wigs there that have had their salaries reduced sufficiently in line with their true value?

Yes to salary reductions and who knows as to what anyone's' true value is as its a subjective thing.

PS, stop going on about Allen , he and his former Chairperson are gone . Its a new ball game under RITA and time will tell how they managed the business in the new environment we find our self in.

I get that people want to moan and blame someone or some thing but the racing world has changed dramatically world wide in the last few years as its popularity declines. So much more competition for peoples time and disposable income. Shit , Stuff even has a millennials reporter.

 

Greg

 

Greg

[Brodie]

4 hours ago, JJ Flash said:

Yes to salary reductions and who knows as to what anyone's' true value is as its a subjective thing.

PS, stop going on about Allen , he and his former Chairperson are gone . Its a new ball game under RITA and time will tell how they managed the business in the new environment we find our self in.

I get that people want to moan and blame someone or some thing but the racing world has changed dramatically world wide in the last few years as its popularity declines. So much more competition for peoples time and disposable income. Shit , Stuff even has a millennials reporter.

 

Greg

 

Greg

Greg, hopefully they only have people there now that don’t make the blatantly stupid decisions that have continued to be made.

Reality is now though, there is no money in the pot to be able to make”racing great again” unfortunately.

For any new person looking in there is not going to be much to entice them to be involved is there?

Unfortunately there is not going to be a living in racing or training horses due to this predicament that these fat cats have put harness in.

Anyone with reasonable Intellect can see that stakes are going to be reduced significantly to a point that it just isn’t feasible for many to have a horse in training.

Therefore trainers can’t afford to be in the industry, buggerall horses means less punting etc.

Hopefully Brodie is not on the money for the sake of harness racing which is something I have enjoyed for a long time.

 

 

 

 

 

[Nowornever]

15 hours ago, holy ravioli said:

some of those country class ,grass trot meets...were diabolical from a punters perspective...the trotting standing starts were the biggest lottery in NZ.

Funny. Thats where I make most of my money. Each to their own.