Bloke Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 7 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: So where are they going to get their share of the capital that they are now obliged to invest in the new Synthetic Track? They did not have the money to build the conference centre at Awapuni but that did not stop them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, Bloke said: Well they have gone from knee deep up to their chin Oh dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Bloke said: I agree rationalisation will probably be forced upon some struggling Clubs. For my sins, I am a member of The Wellington Racing Club and last week I received by email a newsletter from The President, Wayne Guppy in which he spelt out that Race is well and truly in the shit. They should be well used to that. Maybe immune to it. Good thing their loan is guaranteed by RITA. Edited June 1, 2020 by curious 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Huey said: Do you think we really need a GM , Finance , Marketing , Admin function at all of the following clubs? There isn't some amalgamation or centralisation that could occur in this space to save the industry millions? There are huge opportunities everywhere, racing is full of duplication. Ellerslie Trentham Awapuni Otaki New Plymouth Te Rapa Hawkes Bay Wanganui Matamata Pukekohe Huey some of these clubs make use of their facilities for other things other than racing. Take Ellerslie for example, they earn huge income from functions, conferences, public events etc I would imagine this aspect of the business could probably be more profitable than income from racing itself. Therefore GM, Finance, Marketing, Admin roles are required in order to support all arms of the business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 50 minutes ago, All The Aces said: Take Ellerslie for example, they earn huge income from functions, conferences, public events etc I would imagine this aspect of the business could probably be more profitable than income from racing itself. Then why do they need such a huge subsidisation from the rest of the racing industry? You are correct of course that in terms of Revenue generated from racing versus stakes paid and racing costs they make a significant loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 22 hours ago, Kopia said: Not that you seem to give a shit what any of us think, Dean.. Cant blame him entirely for that. So much rubbish is posted on all of the social media sites 22 hours ago, Kopia said: Can you tell us if the financial situation of racing in NZ is that bad that you and your cronies have to sack 30% of the TAB employees, stop the broadcasting of racing on radio Really bad when RITA took over and worsened as a result of Covid shutting down their income streams whilst saddled with heavy fixed costs 23 hours ago, Kopia said: How come you haven't done something about this? They have , restructured employee levels, cut fixed and variable costs And No Chief , this is a reply to Kopia who im sure will have some comeback whereas you have major issues with RITA and its staff and thus cant see wood from trees Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: Really bad when RITA took over and worsened as a result of Covid shutting down their income streams whilst saddled with heavy fixed costs They sat on their hands for TEN MONTHS before doing anything! Arguably 18 MONTHS! Covid-19 affected their revenue stream and probably reduced costs however with regard to costs RITA didn't address the costs for 10 months! Get your rose tinted glasses off JJ. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 2 hours ago, All The Aces said: Huey some of these clubs make use of their facilities for other things other than racing. Take Ellerslie for example, they earn huge income from functions, conferences, public events etc I would imagine this aspect of the business could probably be more profitable than income from racing itself. Therefore GM, Finance, Marketing, Admin roles are required in order to support all arms of the business. I know what you mean ATA, but they all simply cannot justify the top heavy layers they have in operating those clubs, as you say Ellerslie may be an example but you can't tell me they couldn't also operate Te Rapa & Matamata as well, there is an opportunity for centralisation there, they want the smaller clubs to suck it up well they would be more convincing if they set an example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 20 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: And No Chief , this is a reply to Kopia who im sure will have some comeback whereas you have major issues with RITA and its staff and thus cant see wood from trees Unlike you JJ who can't see past the propaganda. I guess you are in the camp that says throwing $48m at AWT's and Racefields Legislation will save the industry! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 17 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: They sat on their hands for TEN MONTHS before doing anything! Arguably 18 MONTHS! You love answering for others, i even stated my reply was to Kopia , whats a polite way of saying butt out . I ignore you most of the time because you talk a lot of biased rubbish IMHO and normally quote old stats. And before you rave about no half year report why bother as it would be largely irrelevant given Covid, just ask any NZX listed company analyst.Further look no further than above re facts . RITA only came into existence with effect from say November last year when they produced a budget and announced the departure of the total failure J Allen. Nobody or group at board level could realistically sort out the mess they inherited from NZRB with 12 months minimum.As you and others kept saying costs needed to be cut . Well , you all got what you wanted and now your all moaning because it effects you in some way. Track closures were carried out by the codes, not RITA, they decided who was going and where. I'm certain they would have had to make tough choices and trade offs to downsize the operation, eg no TAB Radio or higher stakes. What would Kopia and others prefer. Let the pros do their job WP appointed them for. Whinging for whinging's sake on here wont achieve anything. Ill give them 12 months till Christmas say to implement the changes they see as necessary to keep the place afloat and give stakeholders some certainty about distributions. Obviously you and a few others are impatient or simply dont understand how long it takes to restructure/downsize an oversized business. Greg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 39 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: guess you are in the camp that says throwing $48m at AWT's I'm not and see them as a complete waste of money from a CB perspective. To assist you AW's are a WP promise to his supporters with aid from PGF via Shane. RITA will have had little if any say on that but one would think NZTR would have input Greg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) JJ, do you think that RITA is on the right track? How much is Dean McKenzie being paid , or is that confidential? How much is Saville and his associates being paid now for doing very little? The new temporary CEO of HRNZ is Peter Holden, who I personally had never heard of! He comes to HRNZ with less than an impressive record from GRNZ and less than great reports from the greyhound participants! What is the point of putting someone in such an important position that has got no track record of success with every organisation he has been with by the look of it! You only have to look at where he has been to see that HRNZ haven’t got anyone of any real ability to lead harness out of the doldrums, unless you know otherwise? Edited June 2, 2020 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, Brodie said: JJ, do you think that RITA is on the right track? How much is Dean McKenzie being paid , or is that confidential? How much is Saville and his associates being paid now for doing very little? The new temporary CEO of HRNZ is Peter Holden, who I personally had never heard of! He comes to HRNZ with less than an impressive record from GRNZ and less than great reports from the greyhound participants! What is the point of putting someone in such an important position that has got no track record of success with every organisation he has been with by the look of it! You only have to look at where he has been to see that HRNZ haven’t got anyone of any real ability to lead harness out of the doldrums, unless you know otherwise? Ill send you a PM to answer some of your questions when i get some time. Very busy with work at present. Greg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 48 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: You love answering for others, i even stated my reply was to Kopia , whats a polite way of saying butt out . No - if you post something that I disagree with then I will respond. That is the basic tenet of what a Forum is. 49 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: I ignore you most of the time because you talk a lot of biased rubbish IMHO and normally quote old stats. And before you rave about no half year report why bother as it would be largely irrelevant given Covid, just ask any NZX listed company analyst. In terms of the financial situation of RITA I'm quoting the last annual report for the year ending 31 July 2019. The facts in that report are that RITA was trading beyond its means. It was behind on contract payments, was $21m short of cash, needed to use the remaining $10m in revolving credit to continue trading AND when intangible assets were ignored the Equity position was -$21m. That was BEFORE Covid-19. That position is not irrelevant - just follow your own advice and "ask any NZX listed company analyst." Any analyst worth their salt would assess a company's position BEFORE Covid-19 treating the impact of Covid-19 as an extraordinary event i.e. the analyst would look at the fundamentals of the business. If it wasn't solvent or profitable BEFORE Covid-19 then it sure as hell wasn't going to be afterwards unless of course they were in the business of PPE! As for RITA's half-yearly report for the year ending January 2020 it is important because it would have given the industry an insight into what steps had been taken to address the fundamental issues. BUT that aside it is apparent that it took Covid-19 and a call from its creditors BEFORE the RITA Board took any action. I'm guessing that they were winging it believing that the new wagering system and Racefields Legislation would be their saviour. Many astute industry commentators and posters on BOAY, including myself, were pointing out the above FACTS long before Covid-19. 1 hour ago, JJ Flash said: Nobody or group at board level could realistically sort out the mess they inherited from NZRB with 12 months minimum. Then why did the Board sit on their hands for 10 months? Why didn't they address the issues that they were aware of 18 MONTHS ago (the RITA Board was the Ministerial Working Group)? Instead they continued to make promises about Stakes and essentially trade while insolvent. McKenzie told us all (and you quote him) that RITA wasn't insolvent yet less than a week later the Minister tells us all that RITA's creditors had said enough and wanted to be paid within 3 days! 1 hour ago, JJ Flash said: Track closures were carried out by the codes, not RITA, they decided who was going and where. I'm certain they would have had to make tough choices and trade offs to downsize the operation, eg no TAB Radio or higher stakes. Haven't you been following anything concerning the industry over the last two years? The Ministerial Working Group and the commissioned Mesara Report came up with the Track closures scheme. Mesara even went as far as recommending which ones! RITA was tasked with implementing the Working Group/Messara Report recommendations! Don't shift the buck! 1 hour ago, JJ Flash said: Let the pros do their job WP appointed them for. Whinging for whinging's sake on here wont achieve anything. Ill give them 12 months till Christmas say to implement the changes they see as necessary to keep the place afloat and give stakeholders some certainty about distributions. Obviously you and a few others are impatient or simply dont understand how long it takes to restructure/downsize an oversized business. You have unconsciously highlighted the biggest problem - NONE of the current RITA Board or Executive have ANY experience in corporate restructuring!!!!!!!! It didn't take Air New Zealand long to lay off 4,000 employees nor IMMEDIATELY restructure their business due to Covid-19. Even when they had a strong balance sheet!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopia Posted June 2, 2020 Author Share Posted June 2, 2020 A couple of points that I'd like clarified, if possible: The $17m annual fee for the website installation ( rip off ) which the previous RIB entered into-is that coming out of the $72m Peters announced? McKenzie, in his report 26 May said that consultation with the 'Executive Leadership Team' ( of the TAB ?) was starting yesterday...what is he talking about? More jobs gone or what. Just for the record, my view is that spending all that money on 3 artificial tracks is good...for trainers. Not racing. Why oh why common sense didn't prevail and a decent Strathayr installed at Ellerslie ( as at Mooney Valley) I'll never know. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 46 minutes ago, Kopia said: Just for the record, my view is that spending all that money on 3 artificial tracks is good...for trainers. My research on the matter is probably not. But certainly not for owners. Although an owner may save on transport costs (if they are lucky to have their trainer training on the new AWT's) I'm picking that track fees will need to increase and/or more trainers relocating - the increase in track fees will be passed onto owners. As for relocation there are limitations at all three sites for trainer relocation. 46 minutes ago, Kopia said: The $17m annual fee for the website installation ( rip off ) which the previous RIB entered into-is that coming out of the $72m Peters announced? I would say so AND the Broadcasting contract to the NEP Group that they are hooked into in an equally long contract. Plus RITA has a $12m annual commitment to the RIU. You have to subtract $20m from the $72m as that is earmarked specifically for the AWT's and comes from the PGF. So that leaves $52m. Apparently $26m went straight out the door. They also have a BIG problem looming April 2021 (next year) where the $45m from the revolving credit facility is due for payment. Where the hell they are going to pull that from who knows! PS: Just another tidbit of information I picked up recently was that the reason the NRL in Australia doesn't have games occasionally in provincial areas is because of the studio centralisation of "The Bunker" and the HD broadcasting infrastructure required. Sound familiar? Should do because the company that provides that service in Australia is.......the NEP Group! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Kopia said: The $17m annual fee for the website installation ( rip off ) which the previous RIB entered into-is that coming out of the $72m Peters announced? I didn't think the $17m p.a. is to do with the website installation per se is it? That's been paid for hasn't it? I thought that annual payment was for the provision of odds to/for the FOB platform? Edited June 2, 2020 by curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, curious said: I didn't think the $17m p.a. is to do with the website installation per se is it? That's been paid for hasn't it? I thought that annual payment was for the provision of odds to/for the FOB platform? Not entirely. It is a license to use the software and includes updates and new functionality. However it has been reported publicly that NZ's use of new functionality is constrained due to customisation and the cost to test new functionality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 OK. So, is there a separate contract for the supply of odds? I thought that was the whole point so RITA didn't have to employ their own bookies to frame all the markets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, curious said: OK. So, is there a separate contract for the supply of odds? I thought that was the whole point so RITA didn't have to employ their own bookies to frame all the markets. Pass on that detail. But I imagine given the quality of the tactical and operational decision making that we've seen to date NZ can't contract to anyone else to supply that data. I'm guessing there is technical constraint as well where the data interface is largely proprietary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 So, where exactly were the cost savings supposed to come from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Kopia said: McKenzie, in his report 26 May said that consultation with the 'Executive Leadership Team' ( of the TAB ?) was starting yesterday...what is he talking about? More jobs gone or what. I would think so as that's my reading of the situation. The organisation was way to top heavy when the current board took over and this is probably already being addressed but like all things employment related in NZ it takes lots of time to avoid unnecessary and costly PG's , something a few on here fail to understand with their utopian concept of change management Greg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Chief Stipe said: - NONE of the current RITA Board or Executive have ANY experience in corporate restructuring!!!!!!!! You really are a f wit if you believe that to be true. Case closed with you as you just dont get it and talk nonsense on this matter. Its your site and you now pass in my mind as a shock jock. McKenzie head hunted to sort out Addington massive cash losses and more latterly Original foods and thats only him . Suggest you look at Birnies background , oh in fact dont bother as you have already made up your mind Greg Edited June 2, 2020 by JJ Flash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, curious said: So, where exactly were the cost savings supposed to come from? Supposedly the old platform was becoming more and more costly to develop and maintain. However it seems the main strategic driver for development was enabling more products. In my opinion that was a misguided strategy. As Rutherford pointed out the fact that one wagering agency could offer 200+ options on one event and we could only offer 44 wasn't the reason we were unprofitable or losing market share. Plus NZ's market size can't sustain a plethora of options. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: McKenzie head hunted to sort out Addington massive cash losses and more latterly Original foods and thats only him . Suggest you look at Birnies background , oh in fact dont bother as you have already made up your mind Why do you walk in where you haven't a clue? LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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