Riccarton All Weather Track - Q & A Forum 16 September 2020 - PLEASE READ.

[curious]

Yip

 

[Chief Stipe]

Just now, curious said:

Yip

 

FFS What is stopping you guys from making Foxton the epicentre of CD racing?

 

[mikeynz]

4 hours ago, curious said:

Have we lost the edit function or is it just me?

 

Those 3 little dots at top right,click there

[Freda]

2 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

FFS What is stopping you guys from making Foxton the epicentre of CD racing?

 

Petone.

[mikeynz]

There is an article on Mr Saundry and his thoughts on AWT in the ODT today,seems hes keen,biggest concern is what happens for Southern trainers,there is still plenty of life left in the south so dont kill it off.

[Chief Stipe]

Friday, 11 September 2020

NZTR boss stresses need for synthetic track in SI

 

By Steve Hepburn

 

Bernard Saundry. Photo: Getty Images

The racing fraternity in the South Island cannot sit on its hands and wait to see how synthetic tracks perform in the North Island, New Zealand Thoroughbred Racing chief executive Bernard Saundry said last night.

 

Saundry was at a NZTR regional roadshow meeting at Wingatui last night and discussed various aspects of the industry. About 30 people turned up.

The proposed synthetic track at Riccarton Park in Christchurch was much discussed. Questions were asked about its cost, when it would be built and what would be its impact on racing dates for clubs in Otago and Southland.

Saundry said the costs had not yet been finalised but it was likely to be in the region of $13.5million to $14million. He said he could not comment on what the annual maintenance costs could be and he was not prepared to even make a guess.

He admitted some tracks had been ripped up but the technology was getting better. Synthetic tracks had been successful right round the world and were the way of the future.

Construction of such a track was going well in Cambridge and three Australian engineers were coming out of quarantine next Monday to advance the work.

It was hoped to have trials on the track next February-March and then a full season of winter racing.

Funding for another synthetic track at Awapuni was also going well.

There was a suggestion at the meeting that a pause should be made in building the track at Riccarton to see how the tracks went in the North Island.

Saundry said he did not favour waiting.

"Once you build a synthetic training track you will be able to free up grass tracks and you will get better grass-track racing in the North Island.

"Can we afford to do that in the South Island?"

Saundry said punters right round the world wanted consistency of tracks and Australian punters regarded New Zealand as land of heavy tracks.

New Zealand supplied 6% of races broadcast in Australia yet only attracted 2% of the betting turnover.

He strongly disagreed with the suggestion New Zealanders as a whole did not bet.

"New Zealanders have never been given the opportunity to shine. There is not the right technology."

The wrong decisions were made 10 to 15 years ago, he said.

He described the TAB betting system as clunky.

Saundry could not make a commitment on where in the calendar the synthetic track’s racing dates would come from but no club could have guaranteed racing dates in the future.

Questions were asked how trainers could afford to take horses to Riccarton every week to race in a $10,000 race with minimum returns.

NZTR general manager racing and infrastructure Tim Aldridge said the new season had started brightly in the South. So far in the six weeks of racing, there had been 899 starters in South Island meetings. That compared with 635 in the same period last year. Betting turnover had also increased.

Rules on who can attend race meetings were due to be looked at next week but locking out the general public did not have great impact on wagering, as 98% of betting was done off-course. This was especially so in winter, Saundry said.

He believed 100% this region had a future. But clubs needed to work together.

[nomates]

Why bother fronting up to a meeting when you can't answer the questions , why doe's he not know the annual maintenance costs , that is almost more important than the initial setup costs FFS . Then doesn't know how or where race dates will be structured , it's called an effing plan , have a plan in place and budgets in place so you can answer the questions and give industry participants some confidence going forward . 

Would love to hear from someone that attended the meeting .

[mikeynz]

26 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Friday, 11 September 2020

NZTR boss stresses need for synthetic track in SI

 

By Steve Hepburn

 

Bernard Saundry. Photo: Getty Images

Questions were asked about its cost, when it would be built and what would be its impact on racing dates for clubs in Otago and Southland.

 

Questions were asked how trainers could afford to take horses to Riccarton every week to race in a $10,000 race with minimum return

 

More southern meetings,only go to Riccarton for the bigger events,that's where Washdyke and Oamaru come in to play in the winter,simple

[Joe Bloggs]

What a joke, wouldn't hazard a guess, why not Bernie, isn't that how Petone functions? you've bluffed your way through due to apathy, if you get away with this then your doing well, real well, and the Hoi poloi will get what they deserve.

[Chief Stipe]

34 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

"New Zealanders have never been given the opportunity to shine. There is not the right technology."

The wrong decisions were made 10 to 15 years ago, he said.

He described the TAB betting system as clunky.

 

That's a nonsense statement.  We had a system that worked for all the main betting options that punters wanted.  What happened was we thought our monopoly position enabled us to price our products higher than any other provider.  As online alternatives became more readily available we priced our product so it became uncompetitive.  Punters went elsewhere!  

Then they arrogantly stopped providing a service to their core market by getting rid of free to air viewing, publication of form and more recently radio and so on and so on!  They then tried to be smarter than anyone else and purchased a system that offers a plethora of products at higher prices that no-one want's to bet on!

When he describes the TAB betting system as clunky I guess he is referring to the new $25m beast!  

 

[nomates]

The scary thing is they are so confident that the A/W's is a major game changer . What do they do if they are not .

[Chief Stipe]

10 minutes ago, nomates said:

The scary thing is they are so confident that the A/W's is a major game changer . What do they do if they are not .

The question I ask is if they are the game change why is Racing Victoria limiting them to a total of TWO?!  The closed Geelong down to keep it at TWO!

[nomates]

15 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

The question I ask is if they are the game change why is Racing Victoria limiting them to a total of TWO?!  The closed Geelong down to keep it at TWO!

I would suggest that perhaps they don't have the horse numbers that want to run on the sand , or simply the on going maintenance costs didn't justify keeping Geelong going .

I'm sure RV have done their figures and have a plan , something that our management seem incapable of producing . 

When you can't give costings on a project you are simply doing it on a wing and a prayer . It's easy to do it that way when you can easily just walk away with no comeback .

BS doesn't even talk a good game , just another shyster sucking the industry dry .

[Mikie]

I do not know enough about Thoroughbreds or AWT's to even to begin to formulate an opinion on them one way or the other

But can you name me 1 business that would spend $15 million on an Asset (or 3 x $15million = $45million) without knowing it's ongoing running costs?

Mikie

[nomates]

Just now, Mikie said:

I do not know enough about Thoroughbreds or AWT's to even to begin to formulate an opinion on them one way or the other

But can you name me 1 business that would spend $15 million on an Asset (or 3 x $15million = $45million) without knowing it's ongoing running costs?

Mikie

Someone will know , but the issue is when your CEO doesn't know , and on top of that he is doing a roadshow to help promote them , doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they really know what they are doing .

Another possibility is that he does know but the figures are too scary and could scupper the project , build them and then worry about finding the monies to maintain them .

[Chief Stipe]

26 minutes ago, nomates said:

Someone will know , but the issue is when your CEO doesn't know , and on top of that he is doing a roadshow to help promote them , doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they really know what they are doing .

Another possibility is that he does know but the figures are too scary and could scupper the project , build them and then worry about finding the monies to maintain them .

Of course someone knows.  Australia has several of them in multiple States.  Also there are some in other parts of the world.  All of this particular type of Polytrack.

[Freda]

2 hours ago, Joe Bloggs said:

What a joke, wouldn't hazard a guess, why not Bernie, isn't that how Petone functions? you've bluffed your way through due to apathy, if you get away with this then your doing well, real well, and the Hoi poloi will get what they deserve.

I'm afraid so.

  I'm staggered that road-shows up and down the country can be justified when there is nothing specific to say..?

If that doesn't ring alarm bells for those who attended.....oh dear.

[Freda]

46 minutes ago, Mikie said:

I do not know enough about Thoroughbreds or AWT's to even to begin to formulate an opinion on them one way or the other

But can you name me 1 business that would spend $15 million on an Asset (or 3 x $15million = $45million) without knowing it's ongoing running costs?

Mikie

No.

[Reefton]

2 hours ago, Mikie said:

I do not know enough about Thoroughbreds or AWT's to even to begin to formulate an opinion on them one way or the other

But can you name me 1 business that would spend $15 million on an Asset (or 3 x $15million = $45million) without knowing it's ongoing running costs?

Mikie

its bloody easy to spend money when it is not yours

An bad habit of many many politicians, government departments, and local authorities in this little land of ours

 

[mikeynz]

5 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

The question I ask is if they are the game change why is Racing Victoria limiting them to a total of TWO?!  The closed Geelong down to keep it at TWO!

Be fair to say we would have two or three in the south island, ,Riccarton  awt and Timaru grass track,probably throw Oamaru in as well,simple

[Freda]

15 hours ago, nomates said:

Someone will know , but the issue is when your CEO doesn't know , and on top of that he is doing a roadshow to help promote them , doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that they really know what they are doing .

 

Don't forget this is the guy who had to ask ' do you gallop them every day ? '    ye gods...

And, for me [ self-interest foremost here ]   a huge concern is where we will work our horses, both during and after installation.

To be fair, that is not Saundry's job to work out, nor is it the mandate of the engineers, but the CJC must provide some idea going forward.

I gather the idea of an underpass to get access to the inside tracks without contaminating the AWT is considered too expensive, so the track layout will be, from outside in, course proper, allweather, another grass gallop,and the middle [which currently provides three smaller gallop grasses, a small sand, a reverse cinder track, a frost grass, as well as hurdle/steeple grasses ] .

The middle tracks are reported to be going, to guard against contamination.  Inside, will be created small lakes to hold the run-off from the water applied to the AWT, so, unless some innovative thinking comes about, there seems to be no provision for slow working horses other than on the allweather.

The excellent plough, big and small trial gallops and the big sand will be swallowed up by the AWT.

 

 

[Huey]

19 hours ago, nomates said:

Why bother fronting up to a meeting when you can't answer the questions , why doe's he not know the annual maintenance costs , that is almost more important than the initial setup costs FFS . Then doesn't know how or where race dates will be structured , it's called an effing plan , have a plan in place and budgets in place so you can answer the questions and give industry participants some confidence going forward . 

Would love to hear from someone that attended the meeting .

I'm not one bit surprised. He has not done a single positive thing for the sport since arriving from Aus. The sport is descending into a shambles under his leadership, the incompetency is being hidden by COVID and the chaos at the TAB.

You cannot get a single answer out of them that makes any sense, because none of them have a clue what they are doing as they are not racing people!

Surely someone like Pitman who is all for these AWTs wants to know that they will be sustainable into the future and won't negatively impact on his business model by asking NZTR these questions?

Sorry I still can't see these working in NZ ,they will be forced usage and most punters will go off them once the novelty factor is over, they are dead boring!

[Huey]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

Don't forget this is the guy who had to ask ' do you gallop them every day ? '    ye gods...

And, for me [ self-interest foremost here ]   a huge concern is where we will work our horses, both during and after installation.

To be fair, that is not Saundry's job to work out, nor is it the mandate of the engineers, but the CJC must provide some idea going forward.

I gather the idea of an underpass to get access to the inside tracks without contaminating the AWT is considered too expensive, so the track layout will be, from outside in, course proper, allweather, another grass gallop,and the middle [which currently provides three smaller gallop grasses, a small sand, a reverse cinder track, a frost grass, as well as hurdle/steeple grasses ] .

The middle tracks are reported to be going, to guard against contamination.  Inside, will be created small lakes to hold the run-off from the water applied to the AWT, so, unless some innovative thinking comes about, there seems to be no provision for slow working horses other than on the allweather.

The excellent plough, big and small trial gallops and the big sand will be swallowed up by the AWT.

 

 

You can't expect them to make a plan for the future Freda, I would suspect they will expect you to work your horses around the local cricket ground and up and down country roads while they put this amazing facility in.

[Huey]

17 hours ago, Freda said:

I'm afraid so.

  I'm staggered that road-shows up and down the country can be justified when there is nothing specific to say..?

If that doesn't ring alarm bells for those who attended.....oh dear.

They are there so they can say they communicated/collaborated with the industry, enough people in the industry have found out what a total waste of time they are and don't bother going now at any rate. 

[nomates]

3 hours ago, Huey said:

I'm not one bit surprised. He has not done a single positive thing for the sport since arriving from Aus. The sport is descending into a shambles under his leadership, the incompetency is being hidden by COVID and the chaos at the TAB.

You cannot get a single answer out of them that makes any sense, because none of them have a clue what they are doing as they are not racing people!

Surely someone like Pitman who is all for these AWTs wants to know that they will be sustainable into the future and won't negatively impact on his business model by asking NZTR these questions?

Sorry I still can't see these working in NZ ,they will be forced usage and most punters will go off them once the novelty factor is over, they are dead boring!

The big trainers who are based where the A/W's are going in aren't in the least bit worried , more races on their doorstep , less travel , why should they , even if Riccarton and the others only have the 12 meetings a season , it's all about them having a great training track 365 days a year . Get in , perfect , that's all they are interested in . 

They have all gone on record as saying they will be great to have for the training and trialing alone , racing on them is a bonus .

Even if they work out from the point of being utilized regularly , they will not increase revenue enough to justify the initial spend but more so , and the bit that i think will be the harder part , covering maintenance costs .

Edited September 12, 2020 by nomates